[Closed] MK2 Air Conditioning Retrofit 2006

[jdk_ii]

This Group Buy is now closed to any new orders

This group buy is for an AC conversion kit.

To follow the progress, click here (http://www.celicasupra.com/vbforums/showthread.php?t=14944)

Short details:

Supports R12 or R134a.
Fits either 5M or 7M motor
All new parts. It replaces all parts from the firewall evaporator connectors to compressor.
Industrial quality parts. Think commerical truck systems.
Easy to purchase replacement parts (compressor, drier, o-rings)
Engineered better than factory.
Less expensive than getting factory replacment parts
All lines will have a part number just in case you need to replace them.


Group Buy Pricing

AC Kit A: [ $435 US ] Condenser, condenser brackets, hoses and lines, compressor brackets, drier, thermostatic switch, o-rings, trinary hi/lo switch, wiring.


AC Kit B: [ $655 US ] Kit A + new compressor.


Price after GB completes: [ Add $150 ] (explained below)


Options

Spal Condenser Fan $85-$95 (waiting on GB status)
AC line filter. $45. This is a GM AC line filter to trap any particles. Advisable if you have a compressor warranty claim.


Group Buy Deadlines

Two payments required. This to get certain parts in production that mfg's require full payment in advance.


Payment ONE: [ $150US ] Deadline: [ 19.March.2006 ]


Payment TWO: [ $Remaining US ] Deadline: [ 23.April.2006 ]


Shipping cost: $20-30 US, depending on where shipped. This will be factored into the remaining amount. Shipping costs to Canada or outside the US will be more.


Estimated physical availability: [ mid-May 2006 ]




Ordering and Payment

PayPal is preferred. If you can't, I will only accept money order via tracked postal mail.


Shoot me a PM with your Paypal email address, and what kit you want, and I
will send a PayPal request for payment.


Cancellations. Nope. You'll need to find a buyer in your place.
It's too expensive of an item.


Group Buy Cancellation.
I'm confident we will make it. But if for whatever reason, there is a major mfg problem,
and everything falls apart, even with planned backup sources, you'll only be financially exposed to what was purchased and created.
Another reason why I split this into two payments.



Important Notes

The total costs of the kit are slightly padded. This is since I was given some padded estimates.
+I have including shipping to me. +Some of the mfg may do drop shipping, but that's still in negotiations.
+I'm looking at some design mods that should make it easier and possibly cheaper.

Honestly, it will be less expensive.


The post GB price addition is strickly to motivate people to buy in at this time.
There's a minimum 50 and this is serious $ to have tied up. I can float a few, but definitely not double digit quantity.

If we get well into the 40's, I won't be a d*ckhead and the the extra surchage will be much less. ;)

Mind you, this quantity buying is giving us an easy 30% price reduction.


Future Kit Availability: If we are successful with this, it will be easier to convince mfg to make these in ideally lower quanity.



Be patient. This is quite a project. I'm managing 6 different sources to get this project completed.



What you will need after obtaining the kit

an electric fan for the compressor (details of known fitting one's will be provided). This allows you to retain the warranty.
remove your old AC system.
install this one
get it charged


What if I need to replace my evaporator or expansion valve?

Contact Jeff Watson directly. 800-327-2087

Pricing as of 24.March.2006


$148.00 - Evaporator
$40.00 - Expansion Valve


This is the same pricing as non-Toyota replacements. :D



Notes

Winter is the best time to get custom AC parts made. It's downtime for AC manufacturers.
The design is to support 3 different brands of compressors. They are essentially the same. Just might be more convenient if you want to buy locally. Most are available world-wide.
Instructions and AC tuning details will be eventually posted.


Questions? Click here (http://www.celicasupra.com/vbforums/showthread.php?t=14944)

Misc Updates:
2.Dec.05
the black anodizing is medical hard coat. Much more durable than regular anodizing. Looks like OEM semi-gloss.

The aluminum lines will be bare. Only because they will have yellow chromate metal fittings. I'll likely paint mine for the zero bling factor. :D

22.Feb.06
Default ports are for R12. Included are R134a adapters and blue and red cover plugs. Just screw them on for R134a. :D

Medical hard coat anodizing dropped due to possible anodizing problems.

Color will be either standard black anodizing or special factory black OEM color paint.

Pricing added.

23.Feb.06
Added note about if we don't get the numbers (group buy cancellation).

24.Feb.06
A few have asked they would like to add the condenser fan and the AC belt.
This way, they have all the parts. One of the suppliers does sell Spal fans, so I'm
having them come up with a quote. I'll have to resolve which belts fit.

24.March.2006
Added pricing information for new Toyota Evaporator and Expansion Valve

30.March.2006
Added warranty info in second post
Spal Fan
AC line filter

[jdk_ii]

Rational:
1. Provide a new setup to accommodate R134a (r12 can also be used)
2. Improved condenser setup for improved heat exchange.
3. More generic and available replacement parts (o-rings, compressor, etc)
4. New parts. If your AC hasn’t been working for a while, your AC lines likely have rust sediment. Even in clean MK2’s.
5. Reduce diagnostic costs of trying to make a stock AC system work.
6. Very likely less expensive than trying to diagnose and repair your existing AC system.


Design:
The two main upgrade components are the evaporator and compressor.

The condenser is aluminum, 4 pass parallel flow style (new cars use them).
These are easily 30% more efficient than serpentine condensers.

The compressor is commonly used on trucks and industrial farm equipment.
And it’s new, not a rebuilt NipponDenso.


For those skeptical about R134a conversions, the important thing is heat exchange.
This is the condensers job. Also, the same approach has been done on other R134a conversion kits with near 32 degree vent temperatures.
this is a good link (http://www.griffiths.com/porsche/ac/ice/index.html)

Some Design Improvements:

Designed for 5M, 6M and 7M motors. So if you change motors, same parts work.
Dual high / low pressure cut off switch. Eliminates using the one at the evaporator and prevents against high pressure scenarios.
Thermostatic switch to cycle compressor clutch when the evaporator core reaches freezing. It's tunable, elimnates the EPR valve ($$$) and prevents compressor oil starvation.
Reduced diameter barrier hose. Better than R12 hose, and smaller.
Much cleaner design for better air flow
Easy to access service ports
A few pounds lighter than stock system
Excluding compressor, everything is made in the US. :)



Some Q & A

Q. Can I use R12 if I have a source for it?
A. Yes. The default service port fittings are R12. It comes with R134a adapters if you decide to use R134a.

Q. I heard R134a is not as efficient as R12. True?
A. Actually, it's more efficient. It just requires a better heat exchanger (condenser).
The factory condenser is serpetine style, and most all new cars have the parallel flow.
Most who change to R134a in a factory R12 car will only get a cool breeze (in the 40's).

Q. I heard that compressors are designed for either R12 or R134a. True?
A. There are compressors that are noted as refrigerant specific. The one's I've selected support both.
In fact, a R134a compressors is more efficient than a R12 compressor.

Q. Why select different brand compressors?
A. I didn't want to be limited to choice and have future flexibilty.

Q. I heard that R134a is going to be phased out.
A. European legislation wants it replaced by 2011.
The prototype uses C02. It needs to operate at 1500-2000psi +.
That is serious pressure that needs to be addressed for accidental breaches.
Since the US is usually behind a few years, I expect C02 introduction to start
well after 2011.
Given that one can still get R12 after 14 years, R134a won't go away. Just buy a bunch of R134a cans around 2012.

Q. Should I buy a new evaporator?
A. That's a tough one. If your AC hasn't work for a while, it's best
to get it vacuumed before installing the kit. If you get some whistles in your dash,
well, sounds like an evap leak. :( My advice is to get it vacuumed before installing.
It could help expose a problem before hand. Champion Toyota is offering a good price on these (see first post).

Q. Should I buy a new pressure sensor?
A. This is the pressure sensor located in the evaporator box. The answer is no.
The revised design as the pressure sensor located at the receiver/drier. For super
easy testing and replacement.

Q. Do I need any parts from my old AC system?
A. Yes. Mostly the rubber mounting pieces for the soft hoses, rubber mounts
for the condeners, and the foam that keeps the tubes seperated at the front apron.

You may also need an extra EPR valve. This thing in on the passenger side shock tower. The thin line that mounts to it, notoriously siezes.
Lube with PB Blaster and keep your fingers crossed. There's a plan to offer exchange units that have new fitting(s) re-welded.

Q. I want the fan also!
A. Per common request, some want the electric fan also. So it's a complete kit.
I'm negotiating with an AC shop that can supply the off the shelf parts and
provide a warranty.

Q. What kind of warranty is available with the kit?
A. I'm working with suppliers to offer a warranty. The current warranty status is as follows (from date of purchase):


Drier, trinary pressure switch, thermostatic switch, Spal Fan [12 months]
Condenser. [To be negotiated - I want 12 months]
Compressor. It is HIGHLY reccomended to buy the inline filter. The claims process is a bear if you don't [quoted at 12 months]
Lines and hoses [still in negotiations. They initially stated 6 months]
Custom made parts. Compressor brackets, condenser mounting, wiring, etc[None - I usually have 1 or 2 spares of each custom ]

[jdk_ii]

Current List

Total overall: 33

Jim: A x 2, Paid1
CurtC: B x 1, Paid1+Dancing Girls
BruceM: B x 1, EPR, Paid1 (check has flowers)
MrTechNIC: B x 1, Paid1
Daves7MGTE: B x 1, Paid1
DarrowConley: B x 1, Paid1
johnb7: B x 1, Paid1
Mad_83Supra: B x 1, Paid1
PhilG: B x 1, EPR, Paid1
MikeD: B x 1, Paid1
MightyAl: B x 1, Paid1
Yannis: A x 1, EPR, Paid1
Dave(SupraDude117): B x 1, Paid1
Zank: B x 1, Paid1
scarletlizard: B x 1 (maybe A), Paid1
85_6mge : B x 1, Paid1
GregG: B x 1, Paid1
85MK2: B x 1, Paid1
Jukka: B x 1, Paid1
Eric: B x 1, EPR, Paid1
SilverMK2: A x 1, Paid1
Moorman: B X 1, Paid1
JustinH: B x 1, Paid1
Marblehead: B x 2, Paid1x2
NKNVNUNL: B x 1, Paid1
Old Fart: B x 1, Paid1
BuddyJ: B x 1, Paid1, Paid2
Allens85: A x 1, Paid1
trdmkii: B x 1, Paid1
85Soops: B?x1, Paid1
csuprafreak: B x 1

No reply
walkerhiboost: B x 1

[Phil G.]

Let me be the first to say.....

Hit me with the full package brother! :badger:

[rsdeo]

Sounds good, but details on a cut off date would be nice.

Are you aiming for spring 2006 or 2007 if manufacturing is best during the winter season?

Thanks.

[85mk2]

Interested!!! Please keep me updated. Thanks!

[Daves2JZGTE]

lets see 10 years without AC

HUMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM MMMMm



YEA IM IN



Dave

[SupraDude117]

I'm in for one. Possibly two since this is such a great deal :) I voted for the full kit.

-DJ

[-=[TheDude]=-]

I'd definitely buy one

[Greg G]

Let me be the first to say.....

Hit me with the full package brother! :badger:

FWEERFFF - dittos!!!

[MrTechNIC]

Definitively want one of those !
Full kit for me!
I'm alresdy druling, cold air at last!

[Malibyte]

Jim:

Will a Toyota 7M compressor work with your new parts?

Bob

[jdk_ii]

Jim:

Will a Toyota 7M compressor work with your new parts?

Bob
Sure.
The only thing different would be the two lines from the compressor.
These would need to be modified, either with 7M / Toyota fittings
or the inlet plate exchanged. I think the hose fabricator has some generic
Toyota fittings.

The new compressors intended for the kit are Seltec, Sanden or Unicla.

They use these in trucks, buses, farm equipment.

Relatively cheap ~$200-250 (new, not rebuilt), rebuildable and much better than NipponDenso.

[skeen550]

i am in for the whole kit with black compressor, sounds like a winner to me!

[johnb7]

Goodbye atlanta heat. 1 Full kit.

-John

[Ryan]

I'm interested in the Full kit but i can't say for sure if i will have the money till Feb or March

[MikeD]

Just voted for kit without compressor. But I'll consider the compressor also if you guys need to meet minimum quanitity!

[Eric]

The 64 degree January day got me thinking about this, have you made any progress on this Jim? We are depending on you! I want the full kit.

Eric

[jdk_ii]

The 64 degree January day got me thinking about this, have you made any progress on this Jim? We are depending on you! I want the full kit.

Eric

Still waiting on the hose kit estimate.

Holidays always foul things up. :-\

[Greg G]

Jimbo... Im fairly certain you can count on Curt Cozart and Bruce Marinelli to cop a couple full kits. Even tho they dont hang here on the forum, they keep asking abt your progress.

[MAD_83supra]

Jim,
I want the full kit please..... 8~}

[csuprafreek]

I am seriously considering it! CHEERS!...LEE :-)

[trdmkii]

sounds awesome, i'm interested in knowing the full price, my compressor went out recently...

[MWebber]

I'm posting this in all currently active group buys.

Please see the new Group Buy Policy Announcement (http://www.celicasupra.com/vbforums/announcement.php?f=25) effective Jan 13, 2006, before further postings in this group buy.

This Group Buy is 'grandfathered' in and is considered approved. All other aspects of the new GB policy are effective immediatly.

If the vendor/starting member wishes to start a new GB thread to clean up unessessary posts, make information clearer, or for any other reason please contact me and we'll discuss options.

We hope that this will smooth out group buys and reduce fluff, confusion and unessessary posts.

Thanks,

-MW

[jdk_ii]

Current Status.

Still waiting on some quotes.

Obviously the AC business goes on vacation during the winter. :rolleyes:

[ren0]

put me down for one full kit with anodized black. should have the change by april easy.

[rick85p]

I'm in for one. Just need to know timeline.
Rick85P

[SupraDude117]

I might be in for two full kits... one for Agatha and one for Selina... depending on how long I have Selina :) She'll be for sale after I have her fixed up to my liking, New AC system or not...

-Dave

[jdk_ii]

Prices and details finally posted. Whew.

The pricing was a bit higher than my eariler estimate.

This due to extra 3 hard lines (it will make it *way* easier for installation),
increase in condenser pricing, a stupid $20 metric to standard conversion fitting,
and some padded estimates from the hose mfg.

They need final prototypes and CAD drawings. I'll have these done before
the second payment.

Plus I'm thinking of a just an aluminum plug to stick in the EPR. Just remove the inner valve,
bolt in the plug with an o-ring, and voila, no more EPR. :D

The number will be lower. Can't say how much yet, but will update well before the
second (last) payment deadline.

[SilverMk2]

Jim,

From one of those "detail" oriented weenies how stock does this look? Also are you replace all the lines to the firewall or just the compressor, drier, condensor lines in the front?

[jdk_ii]

Jim,

From one of those "detail" oriented weenies how stock does this look? Also are you replace all the lines to the firewall or just the compressor, drier, condensor lines in the front?

No worries. I'm a detail weenie. :D

I want this to look as stock (boring) as possible.

A likely MK2 geek would first notice the electric AC fan. Oh, you switched over to an electric fan.

Then note the condenser is looks slightly different, then start visually tracing the AC system and noting the subtle differences. Then pop the questions.

And if they ask, which car (ie, Toyota) did you retrofit these parts from, one has done a good job.

This was one of our conclusions at Vegas last year since the odds of getting repro parts for the MK2 is next to nil.


I know the test mule does look like a prototype, especially with the JDM plywood extenstion. :badger:


It's all new lines from the compressor to the firewall.

No sense in using old lines that likely have gunk in them and likely oxidized. Mine did (brown goo), and my MK2 is quite clean.

The only part that would make it a completely new sealed system is the evaporator core. I tried to bargain with a Toyota dealer, but it's not an item with that much price flexibility.

[jdk_ii]

Ok, here's a photo-chop of the end front layout. (yeah, I know, it's seriously chopped)

For reference, the lines will lay flatter towards the condenser. And the condenser is actually black. :D

It really cleans up the front area.

I couldn't overlay the side backets since I couldn't get the CAD software to prevent
dragging over the grid. Grrr.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b318/jdk_ii/condenserChop.jpg

[SupraDude117]

So can we buy some full kits yet or not? :)

-Dave

[MrTechNIC]

Dave
Yes you can! 1st post was updated, all info is there.
So guys if you wan't the goods, now's the time to show up!
:)

[MikeD]

Jim, Check your PM. Request sent for full kit. Thanks for your hard work!

[yannis-supras]

I'm interested in buying AC kit A at the moment. I'd like to give the factory 7mgte compressor a chance as I actually have a couple lying around. If it won't work satisfactorily will I be able to buy the compressor later on or if that's not an option will you be kind enough to provide the aftermarket compressor's details and part # so I could look up for it?

[jdk_ii]

I'm interested in buying AC kit A at the moment. I'd like to give the factory 7mgte compressor a chance as I actually have a couple lying around. If it won't work satisfactorily will I be able to buy the compressor later on or if that's not an option will you be kind enough to provide the aftermarket compressor's details and part # so I could look up for it?

Sure.

For the existing 7M, you'll need to get an AC hose adapter. Basically
what some did. Make spliced lines between the 7M compressor and 5M compressor hoses.

Though my recommendation is to go all new. :D

The compressors that will fit are available world wide.

Just search locally for Seltec, Unicla and possibly Sanden (have to resolve it's bolt pattern). The Seltec is a TM-15HD with an 8 groove pulley.

At least to give you a price range.

I'll be gathering all the part numbers as they list them with alternate numbers.
This AC business is crazy. One part has 4 entirely different part numbers. :rolleyes:

The awesome thing about these compressors is they are very rebuildable.

Nippondenso rebuilding is dicey. This from a factory that rebuilds them.

[Darrow]

when can we start paying for the kits?

[yannis-supras]

Sure.

For the existing 7M, you'll need to get an AC hose adapter. Basically
what some did. Make spliced lines between the 7M compressor and 5M compressor hoses.

Though my recommendation is to go all new. :D

I thought that new replacement hard lines/hoses would be included in the kit.

[jdk_ii]

A few notes/updates:

1. I may be selecting my alternate condenser mfg. Same quality, furnace brazed, US made. Black.
Availability is much easier, it's a regular production item and we're not held to a 50 qty minimum.
(a huge concern for this project).

So I'm getting pricing starting at 25 units.

My original choice got swamped with a huge government order, and our peanut
quantities just don't show on the radar. :-\

2. Once I negotiate the pricing on #1, I'll update here and send out invoices.
Likely mid to later next week. I expect with qty, it will be the same price.

[jdk_ii]

I thought that new replacement hard lines/hoses would be included in the kit.

They are.

IF you want to use an existing 7M compressor (or 5M, 1JZ, for that matter),
the two hoses supplied only work with the Seltec/Unicla/Sanden compressors.

One could take the existing two hoses from a factory compressor, cut them
and crimp #8 and #10 male o-ring ferrule fittings, then connect to the two supplied
hoses in the kit. It would look kind of funky, but would work. Theses fittings
are about $3-4 each.

[yannis-supras]

They are.

IF you want to use an existing 7M compressor (or 5M, 1JZ, for that matter),
the two hoses supplied only work with the Seltec/Unicla/Sanden compressors.

One could take the existing two hoses from a factory compressor, cut them
and crimp #8 and #10 male o-ring ferrule fittings, then connect to the two supplied
hoses in the kit. It would look kind of funky, but would work. Theses fittings
are about $3-4 each.
Ok got you now. I'd probably have new hoses to mate with the 7m compressor and keep the ones you include in the kit on the side in case I'll be swapping compressors.

[jdk_ii]

at least two people asked, so it might be a question.

I'll be sending out paypal requests this weekend.

There may be two supplemental kits. One with the SPAL fan (several asked).

And another that is custom parts only kit. You can buy the off the shelf
parts at a later time, though at the vendor retail price.

[yannis-supras]

I'd be interested in the spal condenser fan too, if the price is right ;)

[jdk_ii]

Just a heads up.

You will need to obtain a donor EPR valve sent to me.

This will make an easier install and equates to the same price
as making a custom tube replacement and bracket. And it will look stock. :)

I have 4 here, and misc donations are coming in. clickie (http://www.celicasupra.com/vbforums/showthread.php?t=20473)

I've noted buyers who have these reserved units (either they are far away, or mechanically challenged)

[SilverMk2]

Jim,

I just sent you my paypal address. Another one for the list :D

[jdk_ii]

Update.

Listed those people whom I do not have their paypal address.

First payment deadline is 19.March.2006 (changed from 15.March)

I may be adding a in-line filter. This prevents condenser clogging.
Usually when this happens, they say just replace the condenser
as labor to clean one is more $. Have to figure cost.

[Supradavis]

Jim,

When does the warranty begin for the parts in the kits? When we receive them or when we install them? Reason I ask is that I may get in on the basic kit and purchase the compressor later.

TIA,

[jdk_ii]

Jim,

When does the warranty begin for the parts in the kits? When we receive them or when we install them? Reason I ask is that I may get in on the basic kit and purchase the compressor later.

TIA,

I'm working with a few places that sell the off the shelf parts to include
some form of practical warranty.

It's ranging from 30-90 day warranty once you receive it.

After that, it's the manufacturers's warranty (if one is provided).

The hoses and lines, I'm working with them to make a few extra
just in case.

Custom parts, like brackets, bolts, wiring, electrical, etc, have no warranty.
I usually inspect them prior to shipment.

Compressors are (and will be) a strange beast. This is where compressor manufacturers make their money.

[Greg G]

As Jesse James wld say... I just paid up sukka!

[jdk_ii]

WOOT ! :badger:

Just got word today.

The manufacturer of my preferred condenser has agreed to
to fit it in their production schedule.

ETA's haven't changed (late April, early May).

:cool:

[yannis-supras]

WOOT ! :badger:

Just got word today.

The manufacturer of my preferred condenser has agreed to
to fit it in their production schedule.

ETA's haven't changed (late April, early May).

:cool:
Sounds good, that ETA seems to have moved a bit ahead in schedule :) . That must be a first in complicated GBs like this. Usually it goes the other way around, right?

[jdk_ii]

Sounds good, that ETA seems to have moved a bit ahead in schedule :) . That must be a first in complicated GBs like this. Usually it goes the other way around, right?

I would equate this to coordinating a wedding. Ok, not that bad.

I can only accept their word as to when things will be done.

Then start checking closer to the due date.

One place I have things machined does great work, reasonably priced.
And they accept small production runs.

However, starting at 2 weeks before they estimate completion,
I have to stop by twice a week to make sure they are on target.
Usually not. They said the brackets would be 3 weeks. I planned 5.

At Vegas, those of us who have gone through making custom stuff shared
some good chuckles on some of the fun (not) we have to deal with.

They lost the CAD drawing, they said the design changed (not), they
requote it likes it something entirely new, they treat us like it's the first
time we've contracted something to be built, we have to pay upfront, etc.

:badger:

[jdk_ii]

FYI.

I spoke with Jeff Watson at Champion Toyota.

For those interested in a new evaporator and expansion valve,
contact him directly at 800-327-2087.

I would only reccomend this if
1. Your AC system has been disconnected for a while
2. You recall getting the musty smell (usually dust/debri accumulation)
3. You know your AC system leaks, but tracer dye never showed the leak.
(Sometimes, it's the condener).
4. You want to do this once and be done with it.

Very good price. About $200 for both (shipping not included).

Will post part numbers and exact pricing here tomorrow.

[jdk_ii]

For those that selected the full kit, I want to pre-reserve the compressors.

The compressor that I've selected is from Seltec.

However, there is a near complete US shortage of Unicla compressors, and I don't want this to affect availability and price.

I've done some preliminary organization of your engine setup.

PM me with corrections.


5MGE
CurtC
BruceM
DarrowConley
Mad_83Supra
PhilG
GregG
Eric
Marblehead
Jukka
85MK2
NKNVNUNL
85_6mge
Old Fart
Marblehead's other personality
trdmkii
85soops

7MGTE
MikeD
Dave(SupraDude117)
Zank
scarletlizard
Moorman
Dave7MGTE
johnb7
MrTechNIC
MightyAl
Marblehead

Don't know
JustinH

[jdk_ii]

FYI.

This Group Buy will officially close for any orders on 5 April 2006, at 8AM.

I'm submitting the last manufacturing orders that morning.

[jdk_ii]

Pricing for new Evaporator and Expansion valve.

$148.00 - Evaporator
$40.00 - Expansion Valve

Contact Jeff Watson directly for this pricing.

800-327-2087.

He requested that I did not post part numbers, as they could (and do) change.

[jdk_ii]

A few have asked if a new evaporator/expansion valve is reccomended.

Most definitely
Your AC system has been disconnected and exposed to the elements.

Very Likely
You know you have an AC leak. Tracer dye didn't show anywhere in the engine compartment. And your compressor doesn't show signs of leaking.

You know your AC system leaks. It's been that way for many, many years.
You never bothered to fix it. Less of an issue if you car is a garage queen.

You've inspected your AC lines at one time. They are coated with brown goop.
This is burnt oil, which could lead to compressor fragments in the AC system.

Maybe
Your AC system worked a few years ago. It eventually leaked out over a year.


If you are well adept at replacing an evaporator, and you think your's likely good,
I would leave the existing evaporator. Get the system vacuumed, then charged.
Then see if there are any pressure holding issues.

If you are not mechanically inclined, and are relying on a mechanic to do this,
ask them their advice. Some places only want to fix what's broken. Others
may want all new parts so they are working from a theoretically "new" system.
I think this will help you decide.

[zank]

Pricing for new Evaporator and Expansion valve.

$148.00 - Evaporator
$40.00 - Expansion Valve

Contact Jeff Watson directly for this pricing.

800-327-2087.

He requested that I did not post part numbers, as they could (and do) change.
And these are from Toyota right? can you get part numbers for them too? please

[jdk_ii]

And these are from Toyota right? can you get part numbers for them too? please

Yes, these are new Toyota parts.

This is the same price as aftermarket replacements (see www.rockauto.com).

Jeff requested I do not post the part numbers as they change.
It consumes his time for dud superceded part numbers.

This is a good deal. I could not get this price even with my alternate
Toyota place I buy parts from.

[jdk_ii]

Updates:


Added optional items in first post. Spal Fan, AC line filter*.

Current warranty information added in second post (see last question).


*The AC line filter can be installed can be optionally installed later,
but you'll need to re-charge your system.

Not absolutely required, but nice insurance to prevent damage to other
components if the compressor lets go of a tiny piston fragment.

[SupraDude117]

Okay, I want it all, and I only want to do this once. I'll be calling Jeff Watson sometime this week. I'll take the smaller of the two spal fans and a line filter.

*EDIT* I think I'll pass on the spal fan... I realised I could use the dual flexalite's instead...

-Dave

[JustinH]

Honestly if you are using an electric fan in place of the mechanical one on the radiator you may not even need the addiotionl fan. One provision that would need to be made for those that are using electric fans is for a fan switch. This will turn on the fan when the high pressure side reaches a certain limit that is below the high pressure switch. I had to add this to another car that I converted to electric fans so that the A/C would work properly when you were traveling slow, or at a stop light. So with this system would you even need the condensor fan? Frow how it sounds it only turns on when the main fans are not running. Anyone else have any thoughts on this? Either way I would like to see a provision somewhere on one of the high pressure lines to add this switch as this is how I plan on setting mine up.

[jdk_ii]

Honestly if you are using an electric fan in place of the mechanical one on the radiator you may not even need the addiotionl fan. One provision that would need to be made for those that are using electric fans is for a fan switch. This will turn on the fan when the high pressure side reaches a certain limit that is below the high pressure switch. I had to add this to another car that I converted to electric fans so that the A/C would work properly when you were traveling slow, or at a stop light. So with this system would you even need the condensor fan? Frow how it sounds it only turns on when the main fans are not running. Anyone else have any thoughts on this? Either way I would like to see a provision somewhere on one of the high pressure lines to add this switch as this is how I plan on setting mine up.
That's correct. Something like a Flex-a-lite could be used dual purpose.
Engine cooling, and when the AC is on.

As for high pressure switch, the kit comes with a trinary switch and a fan relay.

If the pressure is too low or too high, it will turn stop the compressor.

If it's running a higher pressure (not exceeding max), it will trigger the fan.

I haven't investigated how to integrate this with radiator electric fans.
Just too many different configurations, but it shouldn't be difficult.

[Eric]

Got my evaporator and expansion valve today. Getting psyched for some frickin' A/C!!!

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c73/eandkgreen/DSC00346.jpg

Eric

[SupraDude117]

I just got off the phone with Jeff and my new evaporator core and an expansion valve are on their way. Plus he gave me a really good deal on some MKIV TT center caps for Tracey's Twin Turbo rims. :cool:

-Dave

[Darrow]

OK I know you said not to post the part numbers but:

I checked the P/N for the evaporator core and it is still in use from 20 years ago. So does anyone know the P/N for the Expansion Valve. I can't find it anywhere.

Thank you
Darrow

[Eric]

Try this for the expansion valve:

88515-14080

Eric

[yannis-supras]

Jim when will you be ready for an international shipping quote? We're reaching the end of the month so I hope that I will have your quote prior to expiration, then again if there's other priorities there I don't mind waiting for when you get the time.

[jdk_ii]

Jim when will you be ready for an international shipping quote? We're reaching the end of the month so I hope that I will have your quote prior to expiration, then again if there's other priorities there I don't mind waiting for when you get the time.
There was a hold up of shipping certain parts to get a reasonably accurate weight.

They should be arriving any day now.

[yannis-supras]

There was a hold up of shipping certain parts to get a reasonably accurate weight.

They should be arriving any day now.
There's no rush from my side, just wanted to make sure that there were not going to be any issues with the expiration date.

[jdk_ii]

For those that signed up for the group buy, I want to make sure you've been getting my project status e-mails.

If not, PM me with your email addy. :)

[jdk_ii]

Important Update for Spal fan status.

http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?p=251985#post251985

[jdk_ii]

Mockup with real parts.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b318/jdk_ii/mockup.jpg

[zank]

LOOKING GOOD! Hopefully I can get my Paperweight of a car running this summer and install my AC system too........wooot

[yannis-supras]

Very nice, the evidence adds up to the excitement!!!

[toyfan]

i feel jealous i missed this buy :( if anyone backs out/ or chooses not to install somone give me a holler...

[MightyAl]

i feel jealous i missed this buy :( if anyone backs out/ or chooses not to install somone give me a holler...

your in luck...pm'ed

[SilverMk2]

Jim,

What model AC compressor do we need for the 7M kit? I think its time to start looking for one...

[jdk_ii]

Jim,

What model AC compressor do we need for the 7M kit? I think its time to start looking for one...

Here's the Seltec part numbers. they have a tendancy to replace, supercede
numbers more often than Madonna changes her hair color.

For 7M belt grooves: old number: 13-45088, new ICE number: 2521170

For 5M V grooves: old number: 13-45092, new ICE number: 2521282


Tomorrow (Tuesday) is the big day. I'm finally heading out to have the final lines made, AC charged, etc.

The project (aka, project from hell) is finally coming to closure.

[BuddyJ]

Thank God (and thank you too, Jim)! We're having 98+ degree days here in OKC and it's been humid to boot. I can't wait.

[jdk_ii]

Thank God (and thank you too, Jim)! We're having 98+ degree days here in OKC and it's been humid to boot. I can't wait.

Affirmitive. :)

I know the south has had hot weather hit soon this year, and is not letting up.

I would have *gladly* shipped the rain we had here. I think it will take all summer to burn it off. :-\

[jdk_ii]

The shop called my work number to tell me that they had to reschedule. In our never ending phone system provider headache, incoming calls got dump to general phone mail box.

Par for the course for our IT department.

I'm re-scheduled for Friday.

He offered to put me up for Friday night and finish everything Satuday.
Damn nice of him. Plus since I noted his 71 442 and I have a bit of knowlege
of these cars, I think that had something to do with it. LOL.

[Phil G.]

Hurry up Dammmittt - 86+ today in the big apple. I am patiently waiting for Mr. UPS dude....:inout7xr:

1971 Olds 442? Love em. W-30? 455 I'm assuming...Convertible?? Hartop??

[jdk_ii]

Hurry up Dammmittt - 86+ today in the big apple. I am patiently waiting for Mr. UPS dude....:inout7xr:

1971 Olds 442? Love em. W-30? 455 I'm assuming...Convertible?? Hartop??

Tell me about it. Talk about throwing a hot, wet blanket on my day.

He's not sure how original the 442 is. Many owners. This is to replace his
original 442 W30 he had as a teenager.

It's a hardtop, black (crappy paint job).

But surprisingly solid for a MA car.

Here's the kicker. The rear end is from a 12K mile 67 442.

He found it from an original 67 442 owner.

Car was t-boned enough to warrant total loss.
The owner bought it from the insurance company, and put it in his barn.
Sitting since the 80's.

Then decided to dismantle it, sell off the parts and cut up the shell
so he wouldn't have to pay a towing charge.

Friggin tears...

[MightyAl]

Tell me about it. Talk about throwing a hot, wet blanket on my day.

He's not sure how original the 442 is. Many owners. This is to replace his
original 442 W30 he had as a teenager.

It's a hardtop, black (crappy paint job).

But surprisingly solid for a MA car.

Here's the kicker. The rear end is from a 12K mile 67 442.

He found it from an original 67 442 owner.

Car was t-boned enough to warrant total loss.
The owner bought it from the insurance company, and put it in his barn.
Sitting since the 80's.

Then decided to dismantle it, sell off the parts and cut up the shell
so he wouldn't have to pay a towing charge.

Friggin tears...

Damn that is sad. I owned a 68 442 vert for 2 years and loved that car. It was far from original and had an anemic 72 455 in it but was a torque monster. I miss the feel of that car for sure.

[zank]

:sign_offt

[Supradavis]

Hurry up Dammmittt - 86+ today in the big apple. I am patiently waiting for Mr. UPS dude....:inout7xr:
You're complaining about 86* ?!?!?!?!

Try 105* here in AZ with barely any breeze at all!!! Gotta run my 2 down-75 air conditioning on the way home from work at 1pm everyday!!! :eek4dance:

Someone tell me again why I didn't get in on this group buy?!?! :ugh:

[MightyAl]

If anyone is interested my kit is up for grabs. Let me know if you are interested.

[jdk_ii]

For those not on the email thread...

As of last Friday, 3pm, my MK2 had cold AC.

Second test, car sitting for a while. Start it up, leave at idle.
I'm estimating about 30 seconds to reach maximum cooling.

Third test, it's starts to rain (like we need more rain in Boston area).
Car fogs up quite nicely. Turn on the AC, and poof, clear windows.

Hopefully, I can forget what a nightmare project this turned into.
Some serious libation is required.



Have all parts by 1 May. The mobile AC business goes into complete chaos starting in May. This year was no exception, complete with no ETA back orders.
Fewer suppliers. I had to deal with 8. Fortunately, some vendors offered to handle more items in the future.
Spal USA has a *few* problems

[Eric]

Yeah!
Jim, get your drunk on bro! My work email ate your last message so I didn't get to read it, any idea on when we can expect delivery? Thanks for all your hard work:good:

Eric

[zank]

Yeah!
Jim, get your drunk on bro! My work email ate your last message so I didn't get to read it, any idea on when we can expect delivery? Thanks for all your hard work:good:

Eric

so does this mean your keeping the car? :inout7xr:

[Eric]

Probably not but who knows, I have had interest locally and a guy is coming to look at it tomorrow. I'll need to have some info for him on it. If no one buys it - well then???

Eric

[jdk_ii]

Jim pops in for a brief moment (living all my free time getting the AC kit finished).

My MK2 has been sitting for a while due to the phantom start and die.
So I got up early before the heat and humidity would make it unbearable
to check some things.

Well, the car runs with no issue. Could be all the damp weather we've had.

And I got to test the AC with the corrected fan (mine was labelled push fan, but actually a puller).


Car at idle.
85 ambient.
300% humidity
On re-circulate
Full fan (and same value at medium fan setting)
Car in sunlight (to trigger the sensor).
Reading from center vent


http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b318/jdk_ii/frosty2.jpg

Damn, I'm happy. This is the effective vent tempature of a R12 car.
This is with R134a. :badger:

Major props to BruceM (he doesn't visit for forums much) for bringing some much needed humor during the many over sized speed bumps during this project.

[MkIISuperSupra]

Very Impressive JDK! Keep up the good work.

Leslie

[SupraDude117]

It is heating up here in Washington. Last few days have hit 100 degrees! Agatha hasn't been driven in a while though so having the A/C kit here sooner wouldn't do me any good. Looking forward to getting the rest of the kit though!

-Dave

[SilverMk2]

100 degrees..... wus ..... 115 degrees here yesterday

[jdk_ii]

Got my carton stapler today (w00t!), so I'll be shipping
about 4 / day this week.

Negotiating with work to have a day off for FedEx motherload pickup won't
fly due to various project schedule.

And you do not know how bad I want this project completed...

[jdk_ii]

Mega-drop at FedEx Friday night and Saturday.

They said shipment email notifications should start appearing
Monday night or Tuesday morning.

1 US and 3 international boxes left to pack. Woot!

Jim
who wants to:
get hammered
have the living room back
and time to work on the MK2...

[SupraDude117]

Awesome job Jim! No one does a better job at group buys than you man :)

-Dave

[jdk_ii]

News...

The first official kit was installed and charged with R134.

Surprisingly, the the adventurous one was BruceM (doesn't visit here much).
A very minty 84.

JoeB (solo1supra) did the install. He'll be posting his install comments at some time in the near future.

1.5 lbs of r134
High: 220
Low: 32

Vent Temp at dealership garage: 50F
Vent temp while driving: 40/41F.

I certain some tuning needs to be done (heck, haven't even done it to my MK2).

[Bruce M]

Jim: Thank you, thank you, thank you for all the leg work and aggravation that went into this AC project. I can now honestly say without any hesitation that I have a few cold ones in my supra.

The temp inside the car dropped yesterday (Wednesday)to 38/39 degrees coming out the center vent. It has been a long time coming.
BTW: The high side is set at 210 not 220.

Also, a big thanks to Joe B for the removal and install of the new system. If one didn't know any better one would think it was OEM!!!

Again, thanks for the effort. It was well worth every penny to have a cool ride again.
BAM!!!

[jdk_ii]

Jim: Thank you, thank you, thank you for all the leg work and aggravation that went into this AC project. I can now honestly say without any hesitation that I have a few cold ones in my supra.

The temp inside the car dropped yesterday (Wednesday)to 38/39 degrees coming out the center vent. It has been a long time coming.
BTW: The high side is set at 210 not 220.

Also, a big thanks to Joe B for the removal and install of the new system. If one didn't know any better one would think it was OEM!!!

Again, thanks for the effort. It was well worth every penny to have a cool ride again.
BAM!!!

TITS ! :badger:

Probably less humid when you got that temp.

Less humidity == lower vent temps.

[MightyAl]

They are attempting to deliver mine. Thanks jim for all the hard work. i just wish you would have told me it was being shipped signature only. No one is ever at my house during the day. I am hoping to get this straightened out and have one more chance. Just letting you know in case it gets shipped back to you.

[jdk_ii]

They are attempting to deliver mine. Thanks jim for all the hard work. i just wish you would have told me it was being shipped signature only. No one is ever at my house during the day. I am hoping to get this straightened out and have one more chance. Just letting you know in case it gets shipped back to you.

Just call FedEx and tell them to hold it for you.

They do this for me quite a bit.

They usually keep it for a couple days after the last delivery attempt.

I've had them hold for nearly 2 weeks.


I think I noted signature required in an early email, but given the amount of speed bumps, u-turns, and New Jersey barriers with this project, I may have thought I did...

Some packages, the FedEx website gave me no choice. Some based on insured amount (obviously). Others, it only gave me signature required.

[MightyAl]

You probably did say sig only which i dont blame you for doing it anyway. Just a bad day for me and then after figuring the fed ex guy would be here around 1ish as this is the time he has showed up the past two days he comes rolling out at 4. Ah well I got my box thanks jim. Now I need someone to buy it as I no longer have a mk2. If anyone knows someone that is interested please let me know. I am willing to deal. Cheers.

[Junkie]

Received Darrow's box yesterday (sat) .... sweet !!!

[Darrow]

Nice. Just one more reason to look forward to comming home. Now if I only had a place to rent in WA.

A big thanks to Jim for doing this group buy.

[SupraDude117]

Received the big box yesterday. Havn't opened it yet but hopefully nothing is damaged. The box looks a little abused on the outside.

-David

[jdk_ii]

Received the big box yesterday. Havn't opened it yet but hopefully nothing is damaged. The box looks a little abused on the outside.

-David

Definitely inspect the box for any internal damage. All US shipments were
insured with FedEx, so if there is any damage, you will need to file a claim pronto.

There should be enough peanuts and bubble wrap to prevent any damage.

Though nothing prevents gorilla boy from tossing boxes around. :-\

[jdk_ii]

Packages left to ship:
3 to Canada (sending 2 on Tuesday, one later in the week)
1 to Scott Hamons (waiting on replacement compressor and two connectors...)

Instructions are almost complete (with pictures!)
Hopefully to finish tonight.

What a long up hill project.

But we now can start cruising with AC without the R12 :bananas:

And inexpensive replacement parts! :badger:

(I seriously need a vacation....)

[Junkie]

Jim/Darrow am I expecting a compressor ???

[jdk_ii]

Jim/Darrow am I expecting a compressor ???

Crap. I have it. :rolleyes:

Sending FedEx tomorrow.

[jdk_ii]

Instructions sent!

:badger:

[jdk_ii]

All shipped. :badger:

One personal deliver to Dan in Toronto next week.

(Jim passes out).

BruceM reported 36-ishF at the vents yesterday.
Ambient 83F. LOW humidity.

I could relate, as we had a rare low humidity day in Boston.

I had to turn the fan speed to low.

[Junkie]

Compressor showed up today :D

[jdk_ii]

Bruce (aka, MK2 Stud Muffin) left me a message today.

Ambient: 78F-ish
Humidity: 35%

Vent Temp: 32/33F

Damn!

[Darrow]

Compressor showed up today :D
Yea!!. Only one month before I can think about putting it in. Thank you Shawn and Jim for getting all of my parts in one place. I owe some one a beer or six.

+1 to post count.

[yannis-supras]

I finally managed to collect my box after two weeks that the greek customs morrons kept it off me. A BIG BIG THANKS to you Jim for the huge effort for putting together such a project. Everything inside the box was intact and it could hardly be any other way considering the excellent packaging. Jim thanks again, I'm looking forward to put this on the car and see what it's like although that won't happen before winter...

[jdk_ii]

There’s lots of people to thank.

First, CurtC, GregG and PhilG for the, ”we’d be up for a retrofit”.
I recall at one of the NE meets, one guy who restored his car paid
something like $1600-1800 for all new Toyota AC parts + R12.
We know we are MK2 weenies, but too frugal to endure that price.

Dave Perry at Four Seasons who took the gamble on us to make
the correct size, and OEM black high performance condenser.

Chris at the MA Truck AC. Sourced parts, made lines and valuable info on mobile AC systems.

Jeff Watson for providing some excellent pricing on new Toyota evaporators and thermostatic valves.

Hot Rod Air for being a great source for a bunch of the parts and being good about volume pricing.

Joe Bartek for showing me some excellent heavy service relays, buying and sending them to me.

Jack Mattson at Mattson Radiator at helping get us the Spal fans, and keeping the pricing in line with original quotes.

Everyone who signed up for the kit. Thanks for not busting my balls. I know it was a long road, much longer that I indicated,
and certainly, I did not expect that every step was going to be an encounter with Murphy.

A stack of other people in the mobile AC business that offered suggestions,
advice and some of the inside details on that crazy market.

BruceM, for being a regular ball buster (in fun) but most importantly, making me laugh when I hit another 3 foot speed bump.
Plus being the #1 pioneer to install the first production kit. And Joe Bartek (again) for helping install Bruce's kit.

There's also a no-thanks list. Vendors, suppliers and fabricators that are more than welcome
to say sure, we can do that for you, then when you present them with the order + cash,
they say, you actually want us to do this?! Losers.

[Solo1Supra]

Glad to have helped in a small way Jim.

[jdk_ii]

Glad to have helped in a small way Jim.

Phooey. More than a small way. :D

Source for industrial/truck relays and connectors. :ss_bling:

Helping "Mr. What's a philips screwdriver" :zzzzz:

[Bruce M]

Phooey. More than a small way. :D

Source for industrial/truck relays and connectors. :ss_bling:

Helping "Mr. What's a philips screwdriver" :zzzzz:

Common guys, cut me a break. I know what a philips scredriver is. Just not very good with it.

Bruce M
1984 White/Burgundy 78,000 miles

[jdk_ii]

Common guys, cut me a break. I know what a philips scredriver is. Just not very good with it.

Bruce M
1984 White/Burgundy 78,000 miles

<heehee> :D

[MAD_83supra]

Does anyone have the fan belt part number they used to install this kit on the 5M?

Well, today I did finally get started on this project. Compressor is installed and the condensor bottom mounts went in fine but the original top rubber mounts fell apart into separate pieces ... must be too old. I need another way to mount the top brackets or see if toyota has new mounts. (or mount it solid? is that a good idea?)

[jdk_ii]

Does anyone have the fan belt part number they used to install this kit on the 5M?

Well, today I did finally get started on this project. Compressor is installed and the condensor bottom mounts went in fine but the original top rubber mounts fell apart into separate pieces ... must be too old. I need another way to mount the top brackets or see if toyota has new mounts. (or mount it solid? is that a good idea?)

JoeB may recall which fan belt he used for BruceM's car. Make sure you
push the idler pulley all the way down before selecting a belt.

Those rubber mounts dry out. I'm seeing this more in southern cars. Um, baked and crunchy is more like it.

I was trying to be a nerd by re-using the upper mounts for the factory bolt
look. Upon reflection, I wish I would have made them differently. Something more flat, then put a bolt through with a rubber washer.

I would advise against hard mounting. You need something like a rubber
washer + bolt since that whole from apron/rad frame can really flex.

Jim
(stuck in Vegas....)

[MAD_83supra]

Ok, the fan belt I bought for my 6mgte / compressor is part number 17415.If i read that right its 41.5 inches? This one is actually on the long side but they didnt have a 41 or a 40.5. The 40 was too short.

now , HOW did you get the #6 line from the drier in through the hole of the apron/rad frame? I cannot figure out how to do that.
I got it.. It was my intercooler mounting braket that was in the way... it went right in easily once i removed the bracket. thanks

[MAD_83supra]

I made some upper brackets using more of those rubber doughnuts like the bottom mounts but a little smaller.
http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL368/756540/8554440/204094094.jpg

I used stands-off's on the sides of the condensor (metal is thicker) to mock up and drill holes. Once I had it all lined up I shorted the stand off and put the rubber behind the header panel out of sight.

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL368/756540/8554440/204094070.jpg
http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL368/756540/8554440/204094116.jpg

Next week I charge up the system. Its holding a vacuum now for over a week.
http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL368/756540/8554440/204136680.jpg
http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL368/756540/8554440/204136653.jpg

[MAD_83supra]

I put 2 lbs in today. temp was in the 40's with high pressure at 200 and low at 30.. thats pretty darn good .. but then a hose blew!! Dang that was fun.
I forgot to tighten up the filter connections.

http://pic40.picturetrail.com/VOL368/756540/8554440/204879370.jpg