Headlights shorting out

[exwhyze]

Every time it gets really wet and damp outside, my headlights will turn back on when i turn my car off. This happened when it last snowed in November, and again just recently after it rained all day. My dad said that they were probably shorting out, and that it was just a loose wire or something.

My headlights worked fine on New Years, but last night at work, they just stopped working completely. I figured that possibly the lowbeams had simultaneously burnt out of my brand new lights, but the blue light by the speedometer didn't come on when i flicked on the highbeams. I took out the Headlight relay and did a voltage test, and got no voltage between any of the terminals. I checked on the internet for prices, and the relay is going to cost me $60. Is there anything I can try before I shell out the cash?

edit: I have an 86 Celica Supra, in case the year really matters for these parts.

[CJSREDPRA]

Admins: Could someone please move this to General Tech???? TIA...

[Nogoodnik]

Pick and pull? I'd see if there are any other toyotas with the same relay and then hit the yard and yank that sucker 'fore somebody else gets it. Also, see if it dries out in a couple days. Since it's just a relay, it's probably a fairly simple piece and you may luck out. I wish I had more info for you. Or that you lived closer and had an '85 I took the relay outta my 85 when the lights went wonky on my '82 so I have spare.

Good luck, either way.

[exwhyze]

alright, my stepdad took it upon himself to buy me a new relay. when my car alarm would go off (it seems to go off about 50% of the time i open my door with the key), the lights wouldnt go off before the new relay. afterwards, they came up and on and flashed; but still nothing with the switch. i believe that it's now the switch that is the culprit, and possibly either fucked up the relay or both were going bad at the same time.

[exwhyze]

DAMMIT! i replaced the switch but nothing, headlights still won't turn on. i double checked the fusible links, so the only thing left is "wiring or ground faulty". i looked around in the electric schematic book and the circuit for the headlights is pretty extensive. right now, im thinking that a wire that moves when the lights flip up and down broke somewhere and is giving me my problems.

any ideas as to anything else i should check? any common breaking problems, etc?

[4SFED]

Not too many people look in the aftermarket engine management electronics, so you haven't gotten many responses to your headlight problem because it should be in General Tech questions.
I am a bit confused - Do the headlights flip up and down? Do the highbeams come on and low beams don't? Do the lights illuminate at all? You say the alarm goes off but the lights don't? You mean the alarm sounds? and the lights come on then? Or what
Sorry I don't have my wiring diagrams out, but if you give a good description of what is happening - what works and what doesn't, I'll try to point you in the right direction.

[exwhyze]

they flip up and down, yes. both beams do not come on, nor does the dash high-beam indicator light when the switch is on. the lights ONLY turn on when the car alarm goes off, and it goes off when i put my key in the driver's door and open it, which it shouldn't.

[935motorsports]

Is your car lowered at all? Check the area above your driver side tire (looking from under the car).

It might not be the same problem, but on mine the wires had touched the tire and a few were worn down to the wire. This is only if the car is low and/or the inner fender liner is missing. Possibly could be getting water in there.

[Dean]

I didn't see this until now, due to where it was posted.
Here's some info from an old post of mine regarding headlight problems.....

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Things to check:
1. Fuse in drivers side kick panel. Labeled as HEAD (RTR). This 7.5 Amp fuse feeds power to the headlight retract motors and nothing else. If it is blown, the headlights will light up but will not pop-up. Open hood to check for lights coming on.
2. Fusible link on the wire coming off the positive battery terminal. This Fusible link will be attached to a black plastic box if your Supra is an 84-86 and more exposed if yours is an 82-83. Check it for continuity with a meter.
3. Retract Relay (under hood, on pass side fender well). Relay is encased in metal and has Retract Relay stamped on it.
4. Retract Control Relay (blue plastic box, under dash, above drivers right knee). Hard to get to, lie on the floor on your back, get good light, look up, you will see the blue box.
5. If your car is an 85 or 86 with factory alarm, it could be the Light Retainer Relay or Theft Deterrent Computer, both located behind armrest on drivers side of rear seat. Commonly get corroded and fail if water gets in there due to rust holes or faulty sunroof drains.

---------------

I'm 99% sure from your description that number 5 is your problem. You'll need to replace one or both of those two relays because they have been water damaged. Rather expensive to buy them new from Toyota. Get them in a wrecking yard or from someone here who has spares. These are rare and hard to find since they only came on 85 and 86 Supras, not any other years. When you remove yours, you could open them up and see if they are badly corroded or if they could be repaired.

Hope that helps you track down the problem.

[exwhyze]

lets say the car alarm computer IS damaged, can i just, say, take it out and smash it with a baseball bat in a field instead of actually fixing the damned thing? it doesn't sound like its a necessary part for my car and i would rather not hear the annoying thing go off ever again.

[Dean]

I'm not sure, so you should get other's opinions on this too...

I "think" you can go without the theft deterrent computer. However, you'll need a good light retainer relay in order for your lights to work properly.
Best bet would be to post in the wanted section, including the part number.

Good luck.

[4SFED]

I've removed the theft deterrent computer no problem. Under back seat driver side armrest

[exwhyze]

well, my dad decided that he's sick of having my car in his driveway, so he said that since he paid for my brother's driver's ed, he's going to take it to a car electronics specialist and pay for it. what a nice guy :) hopefully it doesn't cost too much because im fairly certain that it's going to take a really long fucking time to get it fixed, it took me at least 2 weeks to fix absolutely nothing except my subwoofer and some other incredibly minor thing that i already forgot about.

how does taking cars to a shop work? lets say they fix the problem and then 2 weeks later it's broken again, do they have to fix it again for free? if, say, they break something and don't tell me about it, are they liable for any damage? i've never taken my car to a shop before, since all of my problems have been mechanical thus far and in my range of fixing.

thanks a lot for your help, everybody

[85_6mge]

One other area you might want to explore. Have you checked all the weathertight electrical connections for corrosion? If not get yourself a spray can of electrical contact cleaner (CRC quick dry) and a large tube of dialectic grease.

I had a problem with no high beams and after checking everything that you have (and then some) I found a large connector (white) below the battery (toward the shock tower) that was totally corroded inside. Once I had scrapped out the crud and flushed it with CRC and then packed in the dialectic grease I had high beams. HTH

[exwhyze]

well, this weekend when we were going to take my car to the shop, we got snowed in pretty badly due to this crappy weather we've been having up here. i decided on a whim to try and take out the car alarm computer so i could smash it but i couldn't get the damned thing off of the metal arm that holds it on, and i saw the black retainer box. i took off the plug last time and since the connection looked fine and whatnot, that it was fine. i took it off the arm and popped it open and what do you know, there's corrosion by the diodes underneath the prongs for the plug. i brushed them off with an old toothbrush and this is what i got: http://img0703.paintedover.com/uploads/thumbs/0703/img_1821.jpg (http://paintedover.com/uploads/show.php?loc=0703&f=img_1821.jpg)

how should i go about repairing that? the diodes look fine and when i find my multimeter i'll see if they're working correctly. i was thinking about just scraping away the lighter green plastic on top of the copper and seeing if i could just solder over it until i could find a relatively cheap new headlight retainer board, but i dont see how i'd avoid making a solder bridge or worse yet, ruining my board completely forcing me to buy new. any ideas?

edit: http://www.circuitmedic.com/products/201-3130.shtml
this sounds like it would be what i need, but i think it's mainly for like, computer shit. am i on the right track here?

[Nogoodnik]

If you can't fix it, you gotta buy a new one anyways, right? I'd say go for it. The worst you're gonna get is experience. The beauty of Supras is how easy they can be to fix... With a little skill and a lot of luck. Good Luck!!!

[exwhyze]

i soldered over the corrosion (yeah, it took forever because i forgot solder doesn't stick to anything but clean metal) and voila! working headlights! it is ghetto as fuck and looks horrible but hey, it works for now and i drove my car for the first time since new years' day. heh, that was the only day i'd driven it between today and nov. 17th when my bastard probation officer revoked me.

at any rate, should i be worried about a car fire with my ghetto-ass soldering? i've been using the headlights at a bare minimum since they started working again in case the solder heats up, bridges itself, and fucks me over again, but still, i'd rather not lose my car again FOR GOOD.

props go to dean for being right about what was wrong. thanks a lot dude, you're a lifesaver! i forgot how fun it is to drive a fast car.

[Redrusty84supra]

thanks for all who replied to these posts. I found mine to be the 7.5 amp fuse under the dash kick panel. Probably fried it this morning when I boosted it to start for the summer.

[4SFED]

Wow!!!! It's alive! Way to use search. We also get a bunch more people looking in the electronics threads these days than we used to.