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orangekid
04-22-2011, 06:02 PM
First off, I have a 1980 cressida with a 4me, but it's really just a celica supra in disguise. The engine is completely rebuilt, but i haven't been able to take it on the road yet, because i can't get it to run right. Anyway, here's the situation...

The car will start reliably. But it the engine idles very rough, shakes around a lot, and from the muffler, it sounds like a harley. When I throttle up, the engine revs up very well, but if I hold the throttle open, there still seems to be a slight hiccup (This may be imaginary). Sometimes when I start the engine, it idles smoothly for about 5 seconds, then it starts getting rough as described above. When I pull spark plug wires, All seem to have an effect on the engine, but it's hard to tell exactly, because the engine is running so rough in the first place. I should also mention that the engine had trouble idling before I tore it down, so I'm pretty sure nothing went wrong with the rebuild. I used a block from another 4me as well.

The exhaust and cats are new. I cleaned and resealed the gas tank as well, and there is a new sock filter inside the tank. The lines were also removed, and i blew air through them before re-installation. Everything on the engine was cleaned during the rebuild. Fuel filter is new as well.




Things that i've checked:

-Timing (12 degrees BTDC)

-Spark plugs (new, all are similar in appearance)

-Plug wires (new)

-Distributor cap (new)

-Compression (all within range)

-AFM (the first one checked out, but i messed with the idle mixture screw in an attempt to set the idle, so i swapped a California spec AFM in it's place, which has not been tampered with)

-CSI (great spray pattern. The CSI time switch works too)

-Vacuum and air leaks (sprayed brake cleaner around, no change in idle. Replaced iintake manifold gaskets just in case, but it didn't help)

-ECU (I checked the resistance and voltage values at the ECU as best I could. They seemed to check out)

-Main Injectors (resistance checks out, and they do click as heard through a stethoscope)

-Injector resistor box (checks out great)




Some things I am concerned about:

-The fuel pump is the original, judging by the dirt buildup, which matches the rest of the underside of the car.

-During the rebuild, I had the cylinder head skimmed flat to avoid a BHG. The replacement block also appeared to have been skimmed before (The car it came out of had a BHG, but the block was perfectly flat). This has resulted in a slight cam timing issue. The cam sprocket pin is in alignment when the crank is at 5 degrees BTDC, meaning the the cam is about 2.5 degrees off from where it should be.

-When I pinch the fuel return line, the idle smooths out as the fuel pressure builds up. I got this idea from these forums. Some thought it might be the FPR, but that wasn't always the case.




My plan is to check the fuel pressure next, possibly the coil after that. I also may want to check the vacuum advance mechanism, as it's part of the "Spark Control System" according to my FSM's. Does anyone have any other suggestions or ideas? If I'm an idiot, please inform me...

4SFED
04-22-2011, 07:34 PM
I'd start with the fuel filter and the fuel pump.

Josh=MK1
04-23-2011, 08:47 PM
There is a device called a pulsation damper, (similar in shape and size of a plastic bottle cap but metal). There is one on the fuel pump and one somewhere on the fuel rail. I had to replace the one by the fuel pump years ago. Sorry I don't recall the symptoms, but it is something to think about.

BillyM
04-23-2011, 08:58 PM
If you have a rough idle, you're likely running real rich, real lean, or have a missing cylinder.

First step, let it idle crappy-like, and pull one spark plug wire at a time.
The one that you pull that does not make it idle WORSE is your culprit....

Now, since forcing more fuel pressure clears it up, I'm thinking vacuum leak somewhere. Have you tested fuel pressure?

--BillyM

4SFED
04-23-2011, 10:31 PM
He already did that - see above, second paragraph, fourth sentence. He also looked for vacuum leaks. That's why the next thing I'd check is fuel delivery - pump and filters

orangekid
04-24-2011, 02:54 PM
Yeah, I did check for vacuum leaks, and I did try the plug wire cylinder test. And the fuel filter is new, as well as the sock on the end of the pickup inside the tank. As for the pulsation dampener, I forgot to mention that as one of my concerns. The original one on the fuel rail was leaking under pressure, so i replaced it with another used one. I'll have to make sure it's not leaking as well. I haven't looked at the one on the pump yet, but I'll check it out. And checking the fuel pressure is the next thing I was going to do. I'll probably get a new pump whether it's bad or not, because I'm pretty sure the one under there is the original. I'll post up my findings tomorrow, but keep the suggestions coming if you have them.

BillyM
04-24-2011, 07:16 PM
Fuel pressure next, if good, then you are to the point where you need to figure out the ECU has it running lean.

AFM / Temp / Coolant, etc....

--billyM

davedez
04-25-2011, 11:22 AM
Stupid question but, I have to ask...Did you check if your plug wires are going to the correct place on both sides? I know it's a dumb qustion, but late nights in the garage can make you do some crazy things.

orangekid
04-27-2011, 12:20 AM
Probably checked the plug wires about a dozen times, haha...

Checked the fuel pressure per the FSM, and my results were as follows:

At idle, FPR vacuum line disconnected and pinched off: 38 psi
At idle, FPR vacuum line connected: 32-35 psi
Fuel pressure did not drop quickly after the car was shut off.

So the readings seem to be where they should be. I'm gonna take a good look at the two fuel pressure dampeners tomorrow. Also gonna take a look at the fuel pump. I'll probably grab a new pump and regulator anyway, because they're relatively cheap.

I already checked the AFM and the coolant temp sensor, but i figure I'll go through all the connectors and check if any of the pins have been pushed back.

BillyM
04-27-2011, 08:45 AM
If your fuel pressure in in-spec, you're wasting your time with the pulsation dampeners and the pump/regulator.

Move on.

You need to find out why it is running lean, and rule #1 is vacuum leak.

--billyM

MikeO
04-28-2011, 04:03 AM
I agree with BillyM. However I'd also look at the Fuel Injectors. I recently had a rough idle and a loss of power, it turned out to be one of my Fuel Injectors were bad, it would still make noise while listening with a stethoscope while the engine was running, but when I pulled the plug wire for the no.2 spark plug it still ran rough with no change. I checked for spark and that was good I next check for resistance at the No. 2 Injector and it was way off the scale almost open. The Fuel Injectors should read between 1.5 to 3.0 ohms. I happened to replace all 6 with new ones (not rebuilt) that were on ebay Here are the ones I bought ebay Item number: 380320657676 Good luck!

orangekid
04-28-2011, 05:41 PM
Did I forget to mention that I did check the resistance on the injectors? I did that at the same time I checked the injector resistor box. I'm gonna pick up a propane torch later today and look for vacuum leaks again when i get a chance.

Josh=MK1
05-04-2011, 01:19 AM
A can of starting fluid would work well too! Maybe cheaper! Good luck