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Is it Good To Buy Old Cars ?

15K views 27 replies 12 participants last post by  Gargravarr 
#1 ·
Hi, I'm little bit confused about it. How is it beneficial to go for an old car ? Is this good to buy ? If you have any thoughts please feel free to tell .

Thanks
 
#2 ·
It all depends what you're looking for. Something oldscool, made to last (afterall they are) and reasonably priced vs. plastic and a rubber band for a motor that'll cost your left nut, well...the choice is yours. But if you can't wrench or have little idea about cars, either be willing to learn - old cars are great for that, or buy a newer one that will likely be less problematic.

Welcome to the forum!
 
#3 ·
Lets see. Baby boomers are getting older and downsizing and the younger generations are not into cars like their parents. At some point, I predict prices falling as demand decreases. Take for instance, Model A Fords. Large community of aging members, dying off one by one. Clubs are shrinking and dying out, one by one. Cars will be collectible for a long time, but the number of people really into restoring and driving them will continue to decrease. Good clean original or well restored cars will hold their value or appreciate - the closer to art forms they are considered by the general public, the more valuable. Parts are hard to find, finding good mechanics with experience to work on them is a challenge and can be very expensive. The future is most likely electric, causing either further decline.
 
#4 ·
Read the news the other day. Woman's car suddenly stopped and she saw smoke under the hood and without electrical power, her seat belts, windows and door locks did not function. The fire was growing and she was panicking. A cop saw this and tried to use his baton to break the glass. After much pounding he finally made a hole big enough for the woman to crawl out. High tech has it's pitfalls. Older cars don't have these problems.
 
#5 ·
At the risk of looking like a hippy on a car forum, driving old cars is green.

They may not be *as* efficient, that can be improved upon. But the "embodied energy" as it's called in the construction industry - the energy, labor and raw materials that were required to produce the old car - is enormous, and becomes a huge savings when you resist the urge to buy new.

Get a good looking older car, slap a more efficient/higher performance used engine in it, and you've got a super green street machine.
 
#6 ·
Yeah, he's right. It's also occurred to me that buying used and restoring with used parts is recycling .
 
#7 ·
"They don't make' em like they used to".
Older cars have less CRAP to deal with.
Carburetors,no air bags,no info-tainment sytems and so much more.
Old school is cool.
Depends on your level of mechanical experience.
Mechanics DO drive old cars.
It REALLY depends what you think is an old car.60's and 70's?
 
#8 ·
Estimates show equivalent pollution of up to 50,000 miles worth of emissions for every new car produced. I'm pro-hybrid but, as has been shown, the full life cycle cost of a Prius with batteries puts the Dodge 3500 driver ahead of you..

The big picture always looms out there.

Another thing, cars are not investments. Better to kiss that dollar goodbye when it goes into a vehicle than pretend as much. They are depreciating personal property built with consumable goods that wear out. Some ultra rare exceptions exist, but this is a Toyota forum. Buy, build, drive, enjoy, but don't expect to make money.

Oh...BUT: You get a way cooler ride that's all your own for 5-10 grand, versus buying something for way more off the lot with a loan (or worse yet, leasing) so I'm not saying it isn't money well spent, as long as your necessities are covered first. Don't be the guy with three cars outside his crappy apartment, be the guy with one crappy car outside own his house.
 
#10 ·
Assuming you're talking about for daily use and not as a weekend toy. Supra is getting a bit too old for everyday use. First time I heard, "Sorry, part no longer available" from the Toyota dealership parts counter guy was in about 1996 and now there's virtually nothing in stock. So the biggest disadvantage is having to hunt for parts. If an old Supra breaks down, you're not likely to fix it on the side of the road, rather you'll tow it home where it will sit for weeks while you scour the internet for an elusive good used replacement part. On the other hand, buying an older model "common" car like a Honda Accord could be a great money-saving strategy because there are so many of them that supplies of new parts are still stocked and where a less frequently replaced part is not available new, the salvage yards are full of donors. You just have to realize that its going to need those repairs much more frequently than a newer car.

Also, if your old car gets smashed in an accident, minor damage will cost more to fix than the car is worth. Doesn't make financial sense to carry full coverage, but then most people also don't have the cash to replace it in an emergency or pay to fix it themselves. If it gets dented, it will likely stay dented. If its the other drivers fault, the insurance is only going to pay "book value" which is practically nothing. They know that most people driving 30+ year old cars are doing so because they can't afford better. They know you have no choice but to accept their fist lowball offer because above all, you need to buy another car, ANY car, in order to avoid missing work or school.

Which brings up the point of reliability. You know the older car will break down more often, but you don't know when. If your job requires you be on-time or you have to travel for work, then an old car may be a risk you don't want to take.

As long as you have another car or another way to get around, borrow, uber, public transit, etc. then you may want to consider an old car, but if you don't have a backup, then get the newest car you can safely afford.
 
#14 ·
To me its just an interesting and timely topic. I've been sort of weighing my own options as my Jaguar, which was a rock during its first 16 years, finally scared me on my way to a business meeting in December where I was to be the featured presenter and then was down for two whole weeks waiting on an alternator. I decided it was finally time to upgrade and some of y'all had even recommended ten year old cars to replace it. On the other hand, I could write a check for just about any car I want. Jacob on my left shoulder is telling me to buy a brand new Jaguar and enjoy all the latest gadgets while I'm still alive but the voice of Ebenezer sitting on my right shoulder says just buy an older, used Acura and hold on to your money. Which one will I listen to? I don't know, but it may take till next Christmas to decide.
 
#16 ·
It was popular to swap older Jaguars, but it really never solved the issues. Pre-Ford era Jaguar engines were pretty well bulletproof, but the electronics did them in. You could swap in a Chevy and it was only slightly more reliable, the rest of car was still Lucas and Marelli. The engine would run, but the lights and wipers and such were still flaky. Luckily Ford put mostly Denso electronics in my version.

But gearhead thoughts like that pop into my head all the time. Actually seriously considered for under $10,000 I could purchase another low-mileage XJR, the last year model, three years newer, and just swap my comfort suspension under it (Jaguar sold about 750 so equipped from the factory and called them the Super V8 edition, but those now are unicorns). But what's starting to come unraveled about my 17 year old Jaguar is everything made of plastic, rubber or vinyl is succumbing to age and heat and sun exposure. Buying another aged car that's just better preserved is really only buying a couple of years before it too would succumb.

Plus I'd like to have some new gadgetry. Where I park at work, I really want a backup camera. I thought about installing one, but there's really no way to modify the dash without messing it up. Yea, when you start to think about trying to upgrade your old car to modern standards, it just starts being less and less feasible the more you consider.

And I figure if a really cool car has survived that well to 15 years old, it should probably stay in a collectors collection at that point rather than me parking it out in the Texas sun for 9 hours a day while I'm at work. Like I said before, if its an old Accord, go ahead and beat on it because A) parts are still readily available and B) nobody cares, its never going to be a valuable collector car anyway. But it would be hard to do that to a pristine old Jaguar or mk2 Supra.
 
#18 ·
What mutant said!

Mine is right on the edge. Too nice to really hack up, but by no means pristine.

It's a California "High Desert" car which means it's rust free, but has some sun damage to the paint, front bumper, and interior.

As far as the original poster, what, precisely, "old car" are you looking for? If you want a Celica Supra MKII then you sure came to the right place!

- Jim
 
#19 ·
The originator of this post has not chimed in,yet.
Maybe he/she is just a lurker. That's OK,we are having some fun with the question,here.
I will NEVER buy a new car,not in my life time. Well,I can fix anything and I have done so.
The classic cars have a LOT going for them.REAL sheet metal,REAL style.REAL value.
That's why this forum is here and so many more. We fix 'em and keep them running to our great satisfaction. I'm keeping my Supra ALIVE and running well enough for me.
The Spirit of Supra will just not die,from my way of thinking. Hell,it will out last this tired and old body!
New cars, totally, are a bad financial investment. Yeah,you could be the coolest kid on the block with your 2017 "whatever",but I get more thumbs up that my buddies 2017 Mustang GT. So there.
 
#21 ·
#23 ·
I think I briefly saw that he added a web link to a Toyota dealership in his signature at his last post. I guess the moderators removed the link and banned him.
 
#25 ·
Yeah it could have been a poorly programmed bot or just someone who was a non native english speaker posting just enough for us to chat a bit, then a day or two later changed their signature to a dealership link and replied to a different thread touting how great this dealership was.
 
#26 ·
In my opinion, there are many factors to be considered before buying an old car. If by old, how old do you mean? And what is the purpose of your purchase. Some buyers buy old cars as a form of a hobby and those old cars are often collectibles. Hence, buying them is a good investment for keepsake. However, if you intend to buy an old car that is barely working to make as your daily commute vehicle just to save on costs, then you might have maintenance problems in the long run. Initial purchase price might be attractive because their value has depreciated over time, but prolonged costs could take a toll on your finances. So you have to really see the condition of the car and the state of your finances too.
 
#27 ·
Right now the markets are up and people are flush with cash (collectible cars are all appreciating).

...wait till the next financial-shitshow to pick those collectible cars up cheap when the buyers all go off to nurse their 401k's.

(...but really, you should be pouring money into the market when it dives next, not old cars)

--billyM
 
#28 ·
I'll chime in with agreement on most of the points in this thread. My other car is a 2003 Subaru Legacy and even that has enough electronics to annoy me at times - the HVAC especially, but also the electronic auto gearbox is appalling. Fantastic Subaru build quality as you'd expect, but getting enough power out of the flat-6 is difficult because of all the electronics interfering. I would not want to own a new car where every action I make is second-guessed by a computer. In Dragon, whatever switch I flick does what it's designed to, immediately. Also with the Legacy, two things bug me - first, the interior lights have an option to come on and off with the door locks, but this is disabled on mine and only the dealer can enable it - I can't just flick a switch or enter a code. Two, I somehow lost one of the keys (believe me, I have no idea how) and am looking at a bill for $220 to replace it - a lot of that is for the blank key, then it has to be cut and programmed to the car's security system. All of which I have to do through the dealer.

Yes, there is a good argument for reliability differences in older cars, and I've experienced my fair share. I'm sure a few others keep a decent spares box in the car at all times (I keep a spare coil, for example). And yes, Dragon has broken down on me at inopportune times (burst radiator while out in France, for example). However, all the problems I've had, I've at least had the chance to fix myself. With absolutely everything computerised on a modern vehicle, the moment something goes wrong, the car will insist you limp it to a dealer to fix it. More often than not, the engine bay is covered in plastic which needs specialist tools to remove, or it's a software bug that requires a firmware update to fix. My father in the mid-2000s was granted a company car and chose a brand-new BMW 320dES; since he had to visit client sites, he put a lot of miles on the car, and it suffered greatly. No end of problems, many of them electronic. More than once, a technician had to 'reboot' the whole car because the huge network of computers (claimed to number over 70 ECUs because that's where they stop counting) came out of sync. Fortunately the company footed the bill for all the repairs, but it must've come to thousands of pounds in the 5 years he had the car, maybe as much as 1/4 the value of the brand-new car.

If a car as old as the mk2 suffers a problem, places like this exist to collate all information on repairs, and there are mountains of technical information, some directly from the manufacturer, that have been published. I've dug into the inner workings of the fuel injection system with nothing more than a multimeter, following the technical guides from Toyota. Trying to do that on a CAN-based car would require either a computer (and praying that the diagnostic interface is working properly) or an oscilloscope/logic analyser, both expensive options. Yes, advanced technology does have its advantages when it works properly, such as better fuel economy, tighter control of emissions etc., but it's so damned fragile that when you factor in the cost of repairs when (not if) it all goes wrong, you probably wind up with similar ownership costs.

Others make a good point about manufacturing new cars - even with mass production raising efficiency, just one new car involves a huge amount of cut/pressed/forged/welded metal, shaped plastic, wiring, fabric/leather... All of which requires fuel to be used creating it, then assembling. I'd imagine 50,000 miles worth of driving an older car is a conservative number for the amount of energy involved. Oh, and let's not forget, some of these cars are only built overseas and then shipped to the intended markets, and mass shipping is one of the least regulated causes of pollution ever. Ships burning heavy oil spew hideous amounts of pollutants, far away from any individual country, so there has never been any particular concern for them to be clean. Of course, building cars in factories in the local country is a lot more friendly in this regard.

Add to, older cars are not necessarily smog-producing gas-guzzlers. I'm sure a few people here know the mk2 can get a respectable 300 miles out of its fuel tank (inb4 Ray mentions ethanol gas...) and I'm pretty sure I can get closer to 500 with some effort. Heck, there's an old 1980s Ford Escort with a 1.6-litre diesel engine that can manage a huge 70mpg, a figure that VW's BlueMotion has only just managed to equal (although the less said about VW diesels, the better). CO2 emissions might be high, but the UK government has recently been forced to admit its encouragement for diesels in the early 2000s was short-sighted - diesels do indeed produce lower CO2 per volume of fuel, and with money flowing into the diesel market the technology has advanced considerably, but we're now learning that diesel exhaust contains nitrogen dioxide and fine particulate matter that is hazardous to human health, and extremely difficult to do anything about. At least to deal with CO2 we could in theory plant more trees. Well-maintained older petrols generally burn very clean (Dragon nearly meets the current standards for petrol exhaust cleanliness, within tolerance for hydrocarbons, off by about 0.2% for carbon monoxide); the worst that happens is it starts burning oil, at which point you either overhaul the engine, or throw it away. Diesels have a lot more problems with emissions than petrols, especially with things like particulate filters and exhaust fluids.

That said, nitrogen dioxide is also produced in petrols using direct injection - the higher combustion temperatures are what cause it. So, direct injection and ultra-lean burn might well reduce fuel consumption and CO2 production, but the tradeoff of this technological advancement is higher NO2 emissions that we cannot yet deal with; older port-injected technology might be outdated, but the cooler combustion chambers produce considerably less NO2. A case where improved tech may well be a step backwards.

There's a lot of reasons why newer cars aren't necessarily an improvement, even if the OP was trying to plug a second-hand dealership. I do have a particularly strong opinion because I work with computers, and can see first-hand how advancing technology really has had its drawbacks, and now cars are just computers on wheels.
 
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