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Resto mod from rolling shell

55K views 307 replies 21 participants last post by  Texasissouth 
#1 ·
Hey everyone, I'm new here. I bought a 1986 MKII rolling shell a month or so ago, but just got the title today.
I'm going to be putting a lot of work into this, the plan moving forward will be dropping in a mildly modded 5.3 LS into it.
That being said, I need to check and possibly fix any rust, redo the suspension, as well as re-do the interior in addition, so this will be a long slow journey.
I have no clue what I'm doing, but we'll see how it goes.
 
#190 ·
Oh my god you're telling me. I really was not thinking that early in the morning and neglected to mention that welding the inside of the gussets wasn't going to be doing me any favors. On top of that I can't get an angle grinder in there, so I'm dealing with milling it out with the dremel. I spent hours doing that today and got 2.5 out of 4 done. I think the last one should be fine, but the one I'm partway through has a FAT bead on top and the angle of the gusset is hurting me.
 
#192 · (Edited)
Smart.
Ground down enough that the eccentric bolts work without the arms - now to test with the arms in before I get the subframe dipped and ecoated.






aaaaand the right one doesnt' fit really. I'm pretty sure the stock inner mount got hit by something at some point because it's 4-5mm narrower than the other inner mount, and one of the ears that holds the eccentric part was flat. So I fetched my bolt stretcher to finagle me some more room. also it sliced a small part of the poly bushing zzzzz





In other news I FINALLY got my T3 coilovers that I ordered on Black Friday. Apparently there was a "mix up" and the spindles I sent in go used for someone else, so they had to use someone else's to create mine. Fit and finish ended up ok as far as I can see.
Throw on the T3 needle bearing top hat and camber plate and it's looking good. 450lb hyperco springs on KYB AGX. They came with a lot of washers on the strut but I don't think they're necessary?
Also do the AGX's have an internal bump stop or should I be looking for a solution for that, I can't find any good answers on that one.



 
#194 ·
I had to look at the book to figure out what the factory bumpstop was. I didn't realize that cup thing was it, I checked my bucket of stock front strut stuff. I have the stock perch, hat, brake shield. But I can't find the factory bellows or what I did with the bump stop. I am not a very organized person, in fact if I were to take pictures of how I have all my parts right now everyone would probably be appalled. I'll see if it turns up while I start trying sheet metal work.

After massaging the front perch and using some synthetic grease laying around, I got the right A arm in. Looking good! Seems to have all the adjustment possible and still rotates!

 
#196 ·
Fitting everything together on the rear subframe first is a good idea. Instead of using the alignment template that came with the camber brackets, I ground off the original outer brackets, then reattached the trailing arms with all new bushings and the camber brackets attached and tacked them in place.
However, what you'll find installing the subframe assembly in the car is that the outside camber bolts will either have to be inserted from the outside, making it impossible to remove the trailing arm without dropping the subframe or, you can pick up a set of thin jamb nuts and cut the bolts down to insert them from the inside, which will allow the trailing arm bolts to be removed without dropping the subframe as it originally was. The normal length toe bolts installed in the camber brackets simply won't allow the subframe up into position without some very significant hammering, etc anyway. There's a dimple on both sides that more or less centers the subframe and it's not very easy to modify due to its shape.
Also, to adjust the camber with the car on an alignment rack, you'll need to modify a 20mm wrench by adding a 90 degree bend.
If you don't find your factory front bump stops, LMK and I'll send you a set cheap. Our cars never came with bellows on the front struts like many cars do, although they are available aftermarket. I have a BNIB set of these too, but I really don't think they're necessary, especially with your coilovers.
It's hard to imagine how your inner mount got damaged. Almost always, the trailing arm is the weak link and bends before anything else does. However, it must have been damaged in place or it would have been noticed if anything had been disassembled prior to this. Nice job getting everything together!
 
#197 ·
I did the same thing for locating where the camber brackets would go. And they seem to have full range of adjustment and swing so I think it was a success.

I have held up the subframe inside the car and realized the issue with where the bolts go. I'll have to do some thinking when I get to that stage as you will need access to both sides of the bolt once it's on the car, one side to tighten/loosen and one side to actually set the camber.

I think my front bump stops were too cracked and old and got tossed. i think something must have bumped that mount. My front mount on that side is also a little bent, which is weird. I gotta find an easy way to get it back into shape before I add the front suspension back. It's probably all tied to the same accident that bent up the quarter panel on that side. Drifted into a curb/pole or something of the sort.
 
#198 ·
Like I said about the camber bolts... First, pick up a pair of thin jam nuts with the proper thread. They're about 1/2 the thickness of normal nuts. There will be enough room for a lock washer and jam nut on each outside of the camber brackets. You'll have to shorten the bolts as much as possible so that there's just a couple of threads extending beyond the nut and lock washer once installed and tightened. This will fit fine without any other mods and you'll be able to loosen the nut with a modded 20mm wrench. I mentioned making a 90 degree bend in it to allow access while on an alignment rack. But now that I think about it..... I believe that I ground the head of the wrench down a little thinner for easier access as well. This allows easy (enough) access to both ends of the bolts for loosening/tightening on the outsides and adjustment on the insides.
Before I modified the bolts, it was a PITA to actually adjust the camber. It was virtually impossible to get a wrench on the heads of the bolts on the outside due to virtually no clearance. It wasn't that hard to loosen the nuts on the insides as I could jam something in around the bolt heads enough to loosen the nuts. But then there's no easy way to adjust them. The first time, I used vice grips to adjust the bolts by clamping them to the flat on one side of the bolts and using a thin piece of wood over the bolt threads to protect them on the other side. Then retightened them. Once was enough to know that this wasn't going to work long term, which in my case really only amounted to one more fine adjustment at an alignment shop.
So I modified the bolts as I described and made accessing the adjustments much easier as well as allowing the trailing arm to be removed if necessary without unbolting everything just to lower the subframe.
Might as well do this before installing everything for the first time. Or you'll be dropping the whole assembly to do it later like I had to.
Your bent inner rear bracket might have happened by running over a curb or something similar. Maybe even by sliding into a curb or pole as you suggested. But your same side front mount being bent is not as easy to explain. Was there any damage to the front subframe or LCA on that side? Who knows what might have happened? If it's bent enough to be visible, maybe you can bend it back to where it should be easily enough. Or maybe it would be worth it to discuss straightening it properly on a frame jig. Looking at that area in the pics above, I do see some minor damage on the top with the original suspension. But it's hard to tell if that might create a problem. The drivers side is hidden. In the later pic, it appears that the damage was repaired quite nicely. Both sides look terrific. However, we both know that looking at things in person always beats the crap out of pics. Maybe your best option would be to thoroughly inspect everything for anything out of the ordinary and repair or replace as necessary. If nothing appears obviously whacked, then I would suggest a (usually free) alignment check only. Prior to this, you should manually adjust things as close as you can to where you want them and most importantly, the same on both sides front and rear. The alignment check should be able to tell you if there's anything whacked side to side both front and rear as well as if there's any issues with the actual placement of either subframe.
And if you need a set of front bump stops to mod for your coilovers, LMK and they're yours cheap. I have an extra set of jam nuts that could be thrown in the box as well!
 
#199 ·
Oh I see what you mean now with the jamb nut. Just to replace the standard one with a thinner one to enable you to trim down the bolt so it fits. Makes sense.

I was thinking like both front and rear tires hit sideways on a curb. But suspension arms themselves look pretty good. No damage I can spot.

I've been meaning to take some string and compare my measurements to the stock to make sure everything is straight. Drivers side is fine, passenger side front QP might have been replaced, the sticker and paint on the inside is different. They're old cars anyway, so they're always gonna how some love on them. I'll take a pic of the front bracket tomorrow so you can see it.

I didn't take it this far apart not to make sure it was put back together better in terms of drivability.
 
#200 ·
Inspired by killbill, but a bit less overkill, I remade the front boxes out of 16 Ga. I skipped most of the flaps like killbill did, but did not internally strengthen as I don't plan on using them as jack points. He did a better job, those interested, see page 8





Spend the rest of the day tinkering with the old welder, converting it back to 75/25 gas and smaller wire. Also need to reverse polarity. I kept running into small issues dialing it in so I never got to tack either of the boxes on.

So I decided welding wasn't in the cards today, but I got my cheap ebay hydro handbrake in the mail, so I can unfreeze this second Z32 caliper... but one of the threads wasn't the standard brake line size so I couldn't do that either.
Oh well
 
#201 ·
For the outer camber bolts, since I was doing a full metal resto to the car I was doing the camber mod too at the same time as you are, I just trimmed the offending sheet metal off the car to get better access to the bolt head lol. Took this portion off...

Bumper Auto part Automotive exterior Automotive lighting


I don't see any spot welds there in that pic, but there must be. I'm sure I had to mig weld a bead on the edge of the steel I left there, and then clean it and seal it from inside. Unless all the spot welds were inboard of that piece, then its easy as zipping it off and prime and paint.
 
#202 ·
I too was going to remove that offending sheet, but was leaning toward just bending it out of the way. I was looking at it the other day and I don't believe there are any welds.

Either way the bolt still is so up against that edge so you would have to attach the arm beforehand and it would limit you to dropping the frame to remove the arms.
 
#203 ·
Thats not really a limitation. The subframe, if left fully assembled, is just 4 nuts (plus brake lines). Also, I've never had need to remove an A arm separate of the rest of the rear subframe, they always come off together it seems (20 Supras can't be wrong lol). Even if you did have to remove just an arm, it likely wouldn't work out anyways. Getting the stock bolts to slide out often requires hammering on the other side of them due to the metal sleeves inside of the bushings. Come to think of it, I think I have actually unsuccessfully tried to remove an arm by itself before and been forced to drop the subframe anyways.

I was just under a mk2 yesterday, there are spot welds there. You could bend it into the wheel well, but I wouldn't bend it the other way as it will likely crack the paint when you bend it and then you'll have an enclosed space that you can't access. I must have welded the seam after zipping it off.
 
#204 ·
Your way it is then with the bolts. Adjustment head to the outside! I'll take a look at that flap and think about what I want to do with it. Right now half of it is gone on the right side anyway since that panel is gonezo right now.

I got one of those front boxes welded back on but it is some hideous welding. I almost don't want to document it. I tried prying it off, but the metal just bent, so it is for sure on there, just in the ugliest way imaginable. I was having a lot of arc blowout issues welding in tight spaces and 90 degree angles.

I went to tack on the other box and further disgrace myself; however one side has like a half an inch gap so need to re-make it with more metal.
 
#205 ·
New boxes. I kind of bit off killbill's ideas, I used 16 gauge sheet and instead of spot welding flaps I tee'd them in. The main difference between mine and his is that I more closely followed the stock angles as opposed to his more rectangular box, and I didn't internally reinforce mine as I wasn't sure how easy it's gonna be to get in there and paint and seal everything. My welding is in two words bad and blobby, but I tried prying them apart and it was just bending the metal so I think it should be alright. Most blobs are from going back to fill in gaps.











 
#206 ·
Excellent.
 
#207 ·
Not too bad. Don't jack off them though, they won't be strong enough for that.

For cleaning up the welds and bare metal on the inside, hole saw holes through the floor into the cavity. You will need to do one for the outside edge as well under the fender, unless you can reach into that space from the access hole in the kick panel area by your feet. Technically you should add another hole in the floor where the frame rail is too to get that last side where your weld hit.
 
#208 ·
Nope, definitely not strong enough to jack up the car, however IIRC when reading your frankencar, any time you can tie the rocker to the frame a little stiffer than stock it's ideal.

Yup I think I can reach the rocker inside from inside, otherwise need a hole there, one in the center of the box and then I think I might be able to get into the frame with existing access holes, if not another hole there.
 
#210 ·
I actually wouldn't recommend that at all. 3 point strut tower bars are very trendy, and you see them on all sorts of car, but there really is no strong metal structure to tie to in the center of our cars (and most). My solution to improve the fore/aft twist on a horizontal plane in the engine bay area was to beef up the corner braces. Its all in my reinforcement posts. The next step then is to tie into those with a strut tower bar or permanent bars to the strut tower like I did. And then the next step would be tying the front of the towers down to the frame rail, which I also did.
 
#211 ·
I DID see those corner/up down braces and thought it was a great idea, however I was worried about clearance issues with an LS swap and so forth. How much extra space in the engine bay do those reinforcements take up? It seems like the corner brace would get in the way of the brake/clutch masters
 
#212 ·
They could complicate installing replacement masters and such, that is possible, but they sit above them so there wouldn't be interference normally.

Yeah the front bars could cut into the space a really wide motor takes up, though an LS isn't as wide as a 1uz. But the bars don't actually extend that far off the strut tower. One could of course make some that are removable and or make them go the upper rad support, then permantly enforce the upper rad support and tie it to the frame rails (there is no significant strength in the upper rad support stock btw).
 
#213 ·
I'm definitely considering the strut to corner, perhaps with some heim joints to allow for removal.
It says in your thread that you created your own corner piece from 12 gauge to weld the brace into. However I can't find any documentation of how exactly you went about it, and I'm not sure of any rules of thumb to go by when it comes to plates for structural attachment.

I know the upper rad support is weak cause parts of mine are bent. I didn't pay attention taking things off but hopefully everything will fit back on ok. I could also overlap some angle iron with the upper part of the mount, but not sure about then tying it to the tower/frame... I need a visualization of how much room an LS + accessories is going to take up before I think about that.

The other thing I noticed in your 82 tear apart is you mentioned the child seat tie in plates in the back are welded to the frame rail. Was thinking of a rear brace going from shock tower to shock tower to both tie ins, instead of contracting out a rear roll bar that incorporated the shock towers. It seems to me for the rear shock tower brace most of them are just attached by bolting it to the top of the shock bolt?
 
#214 ·
There was one that was shock to shock directly, which isn't the best arrangement since the shocks are isolated from the body with rubber bushings. Then there was one that attached at the rear seat upper latch mount points. In fact I made one myself out of a piece of angle aluminum, and it works quite well. It definitely isn't enough on its own, the rear shock steel is floppy the way its mounted. I had the same idea you had with the child seat mounts, but I wanted to go further and make one that tied to the rear seat belt shoulder strap mounts (they're for the Euro cars, but all markets got the steel and nuts for them in the chassis). Tying the towers to each other and the frame rigidly is great, but the C pillars need to be tied in more too.

Carlos Brown made a rear strut tower bar similar to what you are proposing, he's posted pictures of it recently in his FS thread but previously in a build thread too. I think Don Lew did something similar as well.

Its on my todo list for my black 86, but way down the priority order.
 
#215 ·
I believe I saw the Carlos bar in another thread when I was researching ideas for the back. But his ties to the rear shocks, though it does run along the side of the tower for bracing. It's still a great idea, especially if you want to keep the rear seats and don't have kids.
For everyone's reference, here is a pic


So ideal in the back would be some sort of contraption with mounting points at the seat latch, rear seat shoulder strap mount, and then the child seat mounts. I can do that easier than outsourcing a cager.
 
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