What did you do to your Supra today? - Page 348
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  1. #3471
    CelicaSupra.com Member
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    A couple of decades ago when this first happened to me, I took a short piece of copper tubing, had my way with it with my doesn't take no for an answer hammer and a file and that lasted about 15 more years. By the time that finally failed, I just ordered a new set of contacts and a plunger. Maybe brushes too. I can't remember. But all of it cost less than a $20 bill. It's an easy fix except for getting the starter in and out. Last time I did it, I removed the bottom bolt from below and the top bolt by using an offset box wrench on the nut and a ratchet with a couple of extensions from above in behind the starter. That was a tight fit. But way easier than any other way I ever tried.

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  3. #3472
    CelicaSupra.com Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by ray85p View Post
    A couple of decades ago when this first happened to me, I took a short piece of copper tubing, had my way with it with my doesn't take no for an answer hammer and a file and that lasted about 15 more years. By the time that finally failed, I just ordered a new set of contacts and a plunger. Maybe brushes too. I can't remember. But all of it cost less than a $20 bill. It's an easy fix except for getting the starter in and out. Last time I did it, I removed the bottom bolt from below and the top bolt by using an offset box wrench on the nut and a ratchet with a couple of extensions from above in behind the starter. That was a tight fit. But way easier than any other way I ever tried.
    Too right there, Ray. With the car up on ramps, I could get to the bolts from underneath, and the confined space is where ratchet spanners really shine. Biggest problem I ran into was that the top bolt simply would not crack; the bottom one gave fairly easily, but at one point, I was lifting the car's suspension up and had visions of lifting the whole front of the car off the ramps - anyone bench-pressed a Supra before?

    Took some sheer British bloody-minded persistence (and a claw hammer) to get the bolt to crack. After that, getting the motor out was a piece of cake. Hopefully now the bolts have been exercised (or is that exorcised?), if I can get a contact/plunger set from Toyota, it should come off without a fight.
    Rob - 100% British
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  4. #3473
    CelicaSupra.com Member drjim's Avatar
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    Backed her out of the garage and took her around the neighborhood a few times. No Hot Laps, just wanted to get the lube moved around inside the trans and diff. Pulled the drivers side outside mirror and got it ready for paint, and finished cleaning up the wiper arms and cowl panel.

    Got a family BBQ today, so I'll paint the parts tomorrow.....

    - Jim
    1985 5-speed "Ms. Swan"

    OH, What A Feeling!

  5. #3474
    CelicaSupra.com Member supraz's Avatar
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    I've been working on the AC. The compressor had a massive leak at the shaft seal. I replaced compressor with a new Four Seasons Denso unit, the front end O-rings with Green HNBR R-134a compatible O-rings so I can tell whether they are Nitrile or HNBR, new Denso condenser, and Denso Reciever-Drier.

    I took the opportunity to clean off 36 years of grime.

    New Condensor with Manifolds attached.jpg
    New Four Seasons compressor with the original manifolds cleaned up and attached

    New Denso Condenser and Drier-Reciever.jpg
    New Denso condensor and Receiver-Drier with cleaned up fan mount and fan

    IMG_2067.jpg
    Cleaned up the compressor suction and discharge hoses

    I took her in to my local Radiator shop to be vacuumed, tested and filled. I'm of course feeling pretty cocky about my car. Well, each time I go, I get brought down to earth by other customer cars!

    1933 Ford 3 Window Businnes Coupe with 409 - 2.jpg
    1933 Ford 3 Window Coupe with 409 Big Block Chevy

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    1958 Ford Thunderbird

    There are some shops that I just LOVE going to.
    Last edited by supraz; 09-11-2019 at 02:59 AM.
    Black 1983 P Type 5 Spd, Cloth Interior, BBK,HRE 17" Wheels, HKS Exhaust
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  6. #3475
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    Started cancer treatment. This was by far the worst spot on the car, and 120 grit cleaned it up with no issues. Other side of the hatch had a bubble in the paint in the same spot, so I stripped it too. Aside from those two areas, I've got a tiny spot at the front of the front fender of all places.

    Plan is for a 2k epoxy primer, base coat and 2k clear to finish it off. Hopefully it turns out looking right. Anyone use Automotivetouchup.com for Super White II before? I've used them for other cars in the past with perfect results, but figured I'd ask first. I'm not too worried about fading after seeing the paint under the removed rear wings compared to the surrounding areas. Factory paint still looks incredible otherwise.


    85 P-Type, White over Maroon Leather, bone stock

  7. #3476
    CelicaSupra.com Member drjim's Avatar
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    Probably should update my build thread, but haven't taken any pix yet.

    Anyway.....

    Got the wiper arms all cleaned up and painted. They look great. Finished repairing the cowl panel, and that's waiting for paint.

    Finished painting the lettering on my cam covers, and after the enamel paint cures a few more days in the sun, I'll mask off the rest of the cover and shoot some clear over the letters.

    And a zillion other 'little things' remain on the list.....

    - Jim
    1985 5-speed "Ms. Swan"

    OH, What A Feeling!

  8. #3477
    CelicaSupra.com Member SupraFiend's Avatar
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    Yup, they literally don't make it like they used to (paint that is).

    Cancer? That's more like a light rash

    Dale, hows the AC in the 83 now? Curious what all needs to be changed to be fully r134 compatable. I have a mint low miles oem setup I'm going to put back into one of my cars one of these years, but still not as low miles as your car.
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  9. #3478
    CelicaSupra.com Member supraz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SupraFiend View Post
    Dale, hows the AC in the 83 now? Curious what all needs to be changed to be fully r134 compatable. I have a mint low miles oem setup I'm going to put back into one of my cars one of these years, but still not as low miles as your car.
    The AC blows cold, but it's not great. Yesterday with ambient temperature at 72 Degrees Fahrenheit, the center vent temperature was 45 Degrees Fahrenheit. Okay, but not exceptional. I didn't think to check the high side and low side pressures when the shop refilled the system. I think that I may try adjusting the EPR as mentioned by Supy1984 in

    https://www.celicasupra.com/forums/s...t=#post1314645

    Post 48. I may buy a cheap AC gauge set to see how it affects the pressures and the vent temperature.

    I had Toyota do the conversion in 2000 and I don't really know what they did. This time I had to replace the compressor and condenser anyways because the system was really dry. I wasn't sure how much, if any, debris from the compressor got into the condenser so it was a given. Because it was dry, I swapped in a new Receiver-Drier, but I would assume that you will never get all the original R12 compatible oil out and should replace it.

    Until recently, where AC manufacturers seem to be colour coding the O-rings (green for HNBR and blue for Neoprene), one could not tell whether black O-rings were Nitrile or Neoprene.

    https://www.compressorworks.com/Uplo...%20CHANGES.PDF
    Four Seasons statement on O-ring colour changes

    I went through the front and replaced most O-rings with Green HNBR, except for the 4 O-rings used to seal the compressor ports to the compressor inlet/outlet manifolds (didn't have that size), but they were shipped new from Four Seasons black which are Neoprene. The original O-rings in this spot looked good anyways.

    I changed the Suction hose and Discharge hose O-rings on both sides, and all the O-rings on the condenser, receiver-drier, and O-rings on the interconnect lines in front of the condenser.

    I DIDN'T change the O-rings on the EPR valve or on the fittings at the firewall that lead into the Evaporator. I should have, but I was too lazy.
    The only O-rings that looked bad were the Receiver-Drier O-rings because they had been taken on and off in the past. The aluminum suction line that runs in front of the condenser and connects to the suction hose near the pump had an O-ring that was REALLY chewed up. In fact, it looked like moisture had been in the fitting and I'm sure I lost seal integrity here. I had to remove chalky aluminum oxide build up and buff the seal surface with metal polish. I applied grease and wax remover, then rinsed with Acetone.

    I just bought a 255 part O-ring kit off of Ebay and it worked great. Note to self: don't kick over the plastic box or you get to play 52 pickup!
    Black 1983 P Type 5 Spd, Cloth Interior, BBK,HRE 17" Wheels, HKS Exhaust
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  10. #3479
    CelicaSupra.com Member
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    Regarding AC, I had the connectors on Dragon changed to support R134a earlier this year, so at least I can get the gas more easily. It's hard to tell, but does anyone else think R134a is not as effective as classic R12? Add in the much shorter time the gas takes the leak through lack of use (supposedly because R134 is a smaller molecule? So it finds holes in the system easier?)...

    The biggest problem is going to be getting R12-compatible lubricant, I guess. Classic car shops carry it, but general availability... I've looked at replacing the necessary components to convert the whole system to R134, but sheesh, it's cheaper just to top up the gas every year or two!
    Rob - 100% British
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  11. #3480
    CelicaSupra.com Member supraz's Avatar
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    The AC effectiveness of the original system with R12 when the car was new was definitely marginal. By comparison to typical American cars, the AC would cool you, it would not freeze you. So as to whether my system with R134a works as efficiently as with R12 is difficult to say. I had my system switched by a Toyota dealership in 2000 and had not measured dashboard vent temperatures before and after.

    I have been reading about vent temperatures of what some people have been achieving with properly functioning R12 systems and they are certainly achieving cooler temperatures than what I am with my R134a system. Naturally, by the time I fixed my AC system, the weather changed and got a lot cooler so I can't tell how it works in hot weather.

    For fun, I measured the vent temperatures of my 2017 Ford Flex AC beside that of my 1983 R134a filled Supra, and the Flex vent temperature was about 40 Degrees F versus 45 Degrees F on my Supra. What I found really interesting was that the AC on my Flex froze me while that of the Supra cooled me. I suspect that it has to do with the interior blower fan speed/volume. The Supra vent size and blower fan speed are mediocre compared to more modern cars.

    I have read, and would tend to believe that increasing the Condenser fan size and/or replacing the Condenser with a more efficient design would improve the performance of an R134a filled system. Apparently, despite common perception, R134a is actually a more efficient coolant than R12.

    A customer of mine who is a scientist, and a car buff, told me that the diffusion rates of R134a and R12 shouldn't really be much different. He states that the O-rings used in automotive AC systems do not actually seal the coolant into the system. It is the lubricant oil circulating in the system that seals the lubricant. It seals the small gaps between O-ring and fittings, and the oil also seals the pores in rubber hoses. He stressed that running the AC system occasionally to keep the oil distributed properly is crucial. This is something I have NOT been doing and it makes sense. Another reason to fire your car up occasionally even if you have it in storage.

    I waited until my compressor shaft seal started leaking (it was REALLY leaking) before I decided to work on the system. A vacuum test wouldn't hold pressure. I had the AC shop drain the remaining R134a and then I bought O-Rings, Receiver/Drier, Condenser, and compressor online. I changed the parts myself and saved a ton of money. Once I had installed everything, I brought it back to the AC shop to vacuum out, leak test, and fill up. While not cheap, it was a lot less expensive than having them do the part changing.
    As long as you don't wait too long between the time you rebuild the system and have it evacuated, moisture should not significantly effect system efficiency.

    I'm going to find out how well I sealed the system up. The compressor I purchased was a Four Seasons branded part that was advertised as new. I'm not sure I believe that. The pump looked new, but there were Denso part numbers on the part indicating that it was a Denso rebuilt pump! Four Seasons didn't respond to my request for clarification on this.
    Black 1983 P Type 5 Spd, Cloth Interior, BBK,HRE 17" Wheels, HKS Exhaust
    White 1984 P Type Auto, Leather Interior, Sunroof, Digital Dash

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