[Gargravarr]

A while back, I watched an episode of the TV show Wheeler Dealers, which featured Mike and Ed refurbishing a Triumph TR6. I mostly watched this for the section where they repaired the fuel tank, and was furious when they showed the repair, but gave no details as to the guy who did it!!

However, there was something else in this episode that caught my attention - after replacing the valve seats, they changed the coolant, and instead of standard water/glycol, they used a proprietory mixture that contains zero water.

I've looked it up, and it's Evans Waterless Coolant.
http://www.evanscoolants.com/index.html

What really made me take notice was when Ed pulled the radiator cap off the engine while it was running (and apparently hot) - because it contains no water and boils at 180'C, the cooling system is not pressurised (or at least, nowhere near that of conventional water!!). Now this sounds a great deal safer, and better for the engine for a multitude of reasons - no water to erode the innards, no pressure to blow up the rad (!!), never needs replacing so lasts the life of the engine... it sounds like quite the silver bullet.

Sounds like.

It does make sense that using something waterless would be good for a car, particularly a Supra! But obviously I'd like some opinions. As Dragon is currently devoid of coolant (grr!), I want to know if anyone thinks it's worth the (admittedly quite considerable) expense. I found the Recommended Coolant thread and will go with Toyota OEM red coolant if I can get it, but this represents a great opportunity to fix something 'once and for all!'

 

[nnywg]

I have a case of the stuff for when my rebuild gets finished. There is also segment about it on Jay Leno's Garage YouTube show. I didn't think it was particularly more expensive than regular coolant, but we're not in the same country either.

 

[Gargravarr]

Direct from the manufacturer, it's £65 for 5 litres, which is about double the price of glycol-based coolant I believe. I am starting to be won over by the corrosion prevention more than anything; I was lucky to get the water pump for mine, and other supplies are drying up fast. The radiator I am buying to replace the burst one is a BNIB Toyota OEM component; I can't think of a better starting point for clearing out the cooling system and making sure it stays clean!

One thing I have heard is that waterless coolant makes the engine run hotter than normal, presumably because it does not absorb heat quite as fast as glycol. Is this true, and would this be detrimental to the head gasket? We all know what the M series is like with those...!

 

[StanS]

The thermostat is supposed to control engine coolant temp. If waterless coolant can't keep temp close to thermostat temp then it could cause engine failure/wear in very hot weather with a lot of acceleration due to insufficient cooling (oil breakdown). Look into a Electric Water Pump for a bit more power by running the engine cooler and then boiling off acids at the end of the ride by running at normal temp (195 deg F) for 10 minutes. Also, only use distilled water to dilute ethylene glycol to prevent corrossion. iirc there are kits to test the coolant available thaqt tells you when to change the coolant.

 

[Gargravarr]

The thermostat is supposed to control engine coolant temp. If waterless coolant can't keep temp close to thermostat temp then it could cause engine failure/wear in very hot weather with a lot of acceleration due to insufficient cooling (oil breakdown). Look into a Electric Water Pump for a bit more power by running the engine cooler and then boiling off acids at the end of the ride by running at normal temp (195 deg F) for 10 minutes. Also, only use distilled water to dilute ethylene glycol to prevent corrossion. iirc there are kits to test the coolant available thaqt tells you when to change the coolant.

Good points all around. I am planning to fit a water temperature gauge eventually, along with oil pressure, but as we're approaching winter over here and our summers don't get blisteringly hot anyway, it sounds like I haven't got much to worry about. I saw electric water pumps are a possibility and there are good arguments for them, but I don't like the idea of tacking them onto a coolant hose. I would also consider the electric fan mod.

I've been buying ready-mixed coolant, and only recently heard about using distilled water to dilute the coolant - it makes a lot of sense!

I think I'm gonna put in an order tomorrow - 12 litres plus flush is gonna be pricey, but versus how much you pay replacing the coolant every few years, it could well work out cheaper, and better for the car.

 

[nnywg]

Direct from the manufacturer, it's £65 for 5 litres...

Yikes, I didn't pay anything close to that. I think that's probably double what I paid...

Like you said though, it's all about the corrosion prevention, and it doesn't get crazy hot here either. Curious to see how it runs, keep us posted.

 

[Gargravarr]

Stuff over here is e-x-p-e-n-s-i-v-e!!

Anyway, I managed to get it slightly cheaper at £57 for 5 litres. Turns out the Supra's cooling system only takes 7.8 litres, so I didn't need a third bottle (I thought it took 10+ litres). It's been filled up now, and based on a preliminary, the car's taken the new coolant fine. Nothing out of the ordinary to report so far. If it holds together, I'll post an update in a week or so when it's all settled in.

 

[SilverMk2]

Personally to me you're trying to fix a problem that doesn't exist. I've gotten several cars to 200k+ miles now using Toyota coolant and distilled water with nary a problem. The cooling systems in these cars work fine with maintenance.

 

[Gargravarr]

Personally to me you're trying to fix a problem that doesn't exist. I've gotten several cars to 200k+ miles now using Toyota coolant and distilled water with nary a problem. The cooling systems in these cars work fine with maintenance.

With regards to the actual cooling capacity of the system for the engine, yes, you're totally right. The system is sound with standard glycol-based coolant. But the factor that majorly influenced my decision was the corrosion protection - I just had a radiator burst, and due to the rarity of mk2 parts outside America, it was only by pure luck that I'd previously made contact with someone who had NOS radiators that I was able to fix it at short notice. This, together with the lower working pressure, will hopefully make the cooling system components last longer - water pumps are only available through Toyota, and they're relatively expensive. It was only through luck that I managed to find one on eBay for much less than half the price Toyota sell them for (quality brand too - Nissan).

No water = less likely to eat the cooling system from the inside out, no pressure = much less likely to burst hoses and other components.

It's al fine in theory, but let's see how this translates to quite expensive practise!

 

[Gargravarr]

While I was discussing cooling with a friend and mk4 owner (his radiator seems to be leaking), I remembered this thread, so I thought I'd post an update. The waterless coolant has given me zero problems; probably helped by a new radiator and flush, the engine reaches operating temperature 5 minutes after pulling away when cold, and the temperature gauge has not once risen above normal. I haven't yet dared to take the cap off while the engine's hot, but the coolant is still a very nice cherry red, and the heating works fine. No leaks, no bulging hoses, everything seems to be working fine. I'll have to drain it out in a year or two to check for any issues, but so far so good!

It's expensive stuff, but it doesn't look like it's doing any harm. Anyone thinking of going the waterless route has my recommendation.

 

[bubblleboi]

Thanks for the update, Gargravarr

 

[StanS]

It's the distilled water that does the trick not the coolant. Tap water usually contains all kinds of chemical salts that react chemically with the block/head/wp/ etc.

 

[racerxj220]

Just use regular green antifreeze mixed appropriately.

http://www.erareplicas.com/427man/engine/antifreeze.htm

This article goes into detail for green, yellow, orange, Toyota, Mercedes, Ford, GM, Honda, etc.

I've used cheap, regular green with tap water for years with no rust issues, all due to the rust/corrosion inhibitors. Just be sure to change your fluids at the recommended intervals, because the inhibitors do become exhausted over time. Some 2J owners use red, some use green. There's nothing you're going to notice different, not even the cooling capacity. I'm not really sure why one would spend so much on "cooling" fluid, when it's actually antifreeze/rust inhibitors. In the Supra crowd of turbo'd cars, there is usually a fan that doesn't pull enough air, air trapped in the system, BHG, loose hose clamp/broken hose, thermostat, etc... It's never the water or antifreeze itself, ever. Properly filled and changed at interval antifreeze will theoretically maintain an iron block/heads for longer than a human is alive, and beyond...

The best coolant is water, of course.

 

[ddd228]

I'm a proponent of using distilled water!
I want pure H2O in my system,not flourides and other stuff.
Well,maybe NOT.
In passing,I use yellow Prestone coolant mixed 50/50 and I'm not worried about it.YET.
For normal coolant:

The PH level IS what you should worry about. That is what can eat out the gaskets and cause corrosion inside your engines.
Engine block and coolantut your voltmeter leads to those parts and if it reads .1 V............EEEK! (EEEEK means holy crap!)

Please see this simple test on You Tube.

http://vehicle-maintenance.wonderhowto.com/how-to/check-your-cars-antifreeze-coolant-using-multimeter-372482/

OK,y'all do this test and get back on this forum. This week.
I thought .2 V. was too much. .07V. is too much!

Here's Jay!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7PykrgzWPQ
$40US a gallon. The stuff will not BOIL! 375*!
It's an 11 minute video. Sorry.

I am seriously considering the change over for this summer!
You need to get ALL of the (H2O) coolant out of the system,3% is OK.(PLEASE be careful about the heater core!).
Updated video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRLXKW2ph0w (9 minutes).
This MAY be a possible way to avoid the dreaded BHG'S!
Why? Watch the second video.

Not as good as Gambles post,but it has info that we all should pay attention to.
OK,I'll go as far as.... "I'M SOLD!"

 

[ddd228]

Waterless coolant? YES!

I'm a proponent of using distilled water!
I want pure H2O in my system,not flourides and other stuff.
Well,maybe NOT.
In passing,I use yellow Prestone coolant mixed 50/50 and I'm not worried about it.YET.
For normal coolant:

The PH level IS what you should worry about. That is what can eat out the gaskets and cause corrosion inside your engines.
Engine block and coolantut your voltmeter leads to those parts and if it reads .1 V............EEEK! (EEEEK means holy crap!)

Please see this simple test on You Tube.

http://vehicle-maintenance.wonderhowto.com/how-to/check-your-cars-antifreeze-coolant-using-multimeter-372482/

OK,y'all do this test and get back on this forum. This week.
I thought .2 V. was too much. .07V. is too much!

Here's Jay!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7PykrgzWPQ
$40US a gallon. The stuff will not BOIL! 375*!
It's an 11 minute video. Sorry.

I am seriously considering the change over for this summer!
You need to get ALL of the (H2O) coolant out of the system,3% is OK.(PLEASE be careful about the heater core!).
Updated video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRLXKW2ph0w (9 minutes).
This MAY be a possible way to avoid the dreaded BHG'S!
Why? Watch the second video.

Not as good as Gambles post,but it has info that we all should pay attention to.
OK,I'll go as far as.... "I'M SOLD!":eek4dance:

If Gamble or Dave H. has the time to make this a sticky,I think we would all benefit.

 

[ddd228]

Thanks for the update, Gargravarr

I had to look up his name,also. Rob.
I like the waterless coolant and I think it should be a sticky,Rob.
I'm bad with names,anyway. Let alone avatars.
Thanks for the thread!

 

[gamble]

Not as good as Gambles post,but it has info that we all should pay attention to.

I post so much i honestly thought i had replied somewhere in here and was like yeahhhh i posted so good.

 

[ddd228]

I post so much i honestly thought i had replied somewhere in here and was like yeahhhh i posted so good.

you are golden,Gamble.
See the gravarrr thread about waterless coolant.
His name is.... ROB.
I was blown away by the stuff that I found!
Needs to be a sticky.

 

[racerxj220]

lol @ quoting yourself.

The proponent for the waterless stuff in this thread is in the UK. This product is from the UK. What a coincidence.

Beats having to pay to be a vendor.

 

[ddd228]

lol @ quoting yourself.

The proponent for the waterless stuff in this thread is in the UK. This product is from the UK. What a coincidence.

Beats having to pay to be a vendor.

I had to quote myself to make sure the damn thing is still at the top of the list.
This is the POST OF THE DECADE!