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What size wheel would you agree with? (please read modified post #1)

  • 16x8

    Votes: 22 20.4%
  • 16x9

    Votes: 17 15.7%
  • 17x8

    Votes: 19 17.6%
  • 17x9

    Votes: 12 11.1%
  • 17x9.5+

    Votes: 21 19.4%
  • 18x (anything)

    Votes: 2 1.9%
  • No thanks on the one piece, I just want modular centers, and I'll provision my own hoops

    Votes: 15 13.9%

Crazy P-Type thread

51850 Views 288 Replies 55 Participants Last post by  supradames11
(UPDATE 3/06/2010) I have added a poll to this thread to try and get a better idea of what kind of sizes people have going through their heads when this "dream" is passing through. PLEASE NOTE, this is only for speculation, as I would like to know if there is a common place that most of us could agree on before I delve into any wheel revisions and modifications. For now, I would like to keep the offsets out of the picture, until some overall dimensions can be invisioned. I have not allowed for multiple answers to be given. It should be invisioned that these sizes will correlate to a ONE PIECE WHEEL, the same for front and rear. Staggered fittment is not in the picture, as it would create double the expense needed for two molds, and so it is out of the question. The only exception to this would be the last choice, where as it would only be the center of modular style 3 piece wheel (most likely a 15 or 16" center). I am doing this just so that when I start to revise designs, I try to have a common interest being employed in what you all will see. Thank you, -Mike END OF UPDATE

Don't anyone get excited. I don't think the p-types will ever be made aftermarket in any larger sizes...ever. But that doesn't mean we can’t dream and drool over them!!! :)

I have been toying with making a model of a larger wheel for the last few days while I have time (Just took four tests in a week, and now have some relax time!)
I thought it would be cool to post up what I have created so far.

Original model:

Revamped with a few more touches:

Graphite spoke faces:

One for the haters :)

General model:

I have plans to do alot of different things with this wheel, but I am also already working on designs that will sort of morph the design of the p-type with some other more modern design styles, such as the Volk/Rays TE37 and Simmons. Let me know what you think might be something cool, and if I have the time I'll try to model it if I also think it would be neat. Thanks for looking, -Mike.

MODS- Please feel free to move this to the Wheels / Toilet Threads if you feel necessary :p
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To machine a 17x9.0 wheel out of billet it would have to be 11" thick and 19" in diameter. That's ~3117 in^3.

The density of aluminum is 0.098 lb/in^3. So the total weight would be 305lb.

The cost of aluminum is $0.90/lb. That's ~$274 per wheel just for the material.:32:

I wonder how much the machining would cost? Aluminum is soft and not too hard on tooling, but the time on the machine?
The drawings are great and you've gone further towards the dream than anyone so far.:thumbsup:

One of the things I'm hoping to do when time permits is to take classes in CNC programming. I'm in that machine shop every week and those machines are just sitting there idle when I'm there.:sadbanana: Maybe someday I'll be lucky enough to get some time on them. The cost per wheel would probably only be material, which isn't bad considering.

I estimated that to do just centers for a three piece wheel the billets would be ~$130 each.:eek4dance:
Mike are you referring to me? If so, my name is Raj and no problem as I'm really bad with names too.

That would be cool. I like your design, but I would definitely be changing a few things in order to fit my personal requirements. Alas though I can't get access to the machines until I have started the CNC classes. Till then I'm restricted to the other machinery there and doing everything by hand would take for ever.

I have the blank hoops in the garage waiting for such a project.
Forgeline did this for a customer. Machined straight from a block of aluminum. $4000 per wheel.
James all I can say is, "WOW!". What was the car and the specs on the wheels? Just think from my calculations >280lbs was scrap from each billet.

Mike, I've posted this pic many times. These are blank and ready for any center of a certain diameter.

18" inner hoops, 17" there too.

Outer hoops, 17" on the left and 18" on the right. If I remember correctly the center would have to have a diameter of 15" as the outer hoops are stepped as you can see in the picture above. I've been saving them for such a project some day.

Your idea to buy three piece wheels to source hoops is a good idea, but generally the hoops are what is damaged on older wheels.
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$800 to $1000 for all eight hoops, but they will make them exactly to your spec.

I've been thinking about using stock Ptype wheels for donor centers for a while. I really need to pull one out and see what can be cut off and machined.
Mike, looks awesome. May I make a suggestion?

Make the mounting pad (where the wheel mounts to the hub) an inch thicker, increase the rear hoop by an inch and remove that bit of front lip by the hoop outside.

Also try the hoop mounted on the front of all the hoops as well with a one inch thicker mounting pad (where the wheel mounts to the hub).
Mike, absolutely a concave face is the way to go. Your design is near perfect. I would just add an inch on the mounting pad, then shift the hoops.

For example if the inner hoop was 6" and the outer was 4", I would use a 7" and 3" hoop respectively. Why? Caliper clearance front and rear. The concave design of the face would assist with this, unfortunately not enough.

If such a wheel was manufactured it would be nice if stock center caps and lugs could be used.

I prefer the 3 piece design. Then diameter and widths are up to the end user.

Let see my wish list...
  • 15" diameter center. 16"+ wheels then.
  • Concave face.
  • Thick mounting pad.
  • Use of stock center caps and lugs.
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Mike, nice drawing there.

In your previous drawing,

I have always envisioned the follwing.

For the front wheel the area in between the two red lines should be removed. The inner hoop and center mounting pad both increased in width of by one inch. Total width from edge to edge would be 9" (for an 8" wide wheel).

The rear would be the same as the front, but the outer hoop would have an extra inch of lip on the outer edge past the chamfer. Total width from edge to edge would be 10" (for an 9" wide wheel).
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Brembo and Sumitomo calipers require more clearance. 1.5" to 2".
I happen to have a digital caliper sitting on the shelf next to a freshly-blasted and painted hub at home...

I'll put them up ~6pm est.

--BillyM caliper?

Is that a new Toyota drive by wire braking system? A recall near you.:duh::naughty::eek4dance:

Oh, Vernier caliper.
You're such a spoil sport Billy. Give it up or I'll build a trebushay and lob inappropriate objects in your general direction.

I'm in a fully equipped machine shop every week. Twelve CNC machines just sitting there idle. One day, one day... Great drawings Mike. I hope someday you get to live the dream and build your wheels.
Interesting center cap. Doesn't look bad. I like it, though the stock cap is so unique.

17x8.0 +10 for the front would be better. +5 offset for 17x8.5.
On the front I'm running a 235/40-17 tyre with a 17x8.5 +6 rim and it fits beautifully. A 245/40-17 would work great too. All this is why centers are the best way to go. Ideally everyone can then choose widths and offsets to their own tastes and requirements.

Billy, I'm going to start building that trebushay... Just need a few good able men and women to crank it up and things to lob. Old wheels, car shells, whales (like the Japanese it's for research), old people or perhaps diseased people. Yes, anyone got any diseased people lying around?:naughty:
Starion wheels! Nice job, they really do look good.
the starions are less cool due to the fact they dont clear big brakes. that should be top of the list for most ppl when choosing wheel/tire options.
Yes, stock starions have their clearance issues, but the units I created have around 2.4 inches of Big Brake "personal space". ;)
Actually Starions will clear the JK BBK with correct parts.

What more could you want?
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I too agree with Austin.

Talk is cheap, put your money where your mouth is.

Look at the 240Z group. They got enough members together to persuade Rota in producing wheels they required. 17x9.0 -13 and 17x9.5 -19. Those are drastic offsets, but Rota produced them.

So, what does it take? At least 50 orders with cash in advance. Believe me I understand for most their beloved MK2 is not the center of their universe and there are more important things in life. So unfortunately I don't see that happening with this group.

But it is okay to dream sometimes.
Well, let's just pretend we didn't more then ten sets, and they were idk, $2500 a set. Who'd be in?

I better start saving now. Maybe I should consider getting a job just for this...:thumbsup:
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