Toyota Celica Supra Forum banner

1 - 20 of 41 Posts

·
Founding Member
Joined
·
6,423 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Still working out minor bugs in the blue 84 project. Trying to fix the window so it doesn't "rattle" when I shut the door. I've tried just about everything but now at my wits end. When I finally find a position that it doesn't seem to rattle so much, then the window doesn't seal very good. Also, when motoring upwards, the forward part of the window seems to hit the upper stop first, then the back of the window. Instructions in the TSRM are of little help, leaving it more or less a trial and error process. Any tips would be appreciated.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,271 Posts
i recently replaced the drivers side motor in my 85, and while i don't have any rattling, the back of my window hits the stop before the front. as far as i care, it's designed to do that.

i negated any rattling by doing up pretty much every adjustable bracket as tight as possible. it just seemed to work right away.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
472 Posts
Phil,

I cannot offer any advice or wisdom at the moment. However, I can raise a glass in your direction, as I feel for you. I am going through the same problems on another project I'm trying to finish up (Mk2 MR2). Just when I thought I had it *perfect*, I find I get severe wind noise at highway speeds.

Good luck, man. I'm almost to the point of calling a glass company out. Almost. I'm still on my "I can do it better than those half-ass 'professionals' kick." If I find a method, I'll pass it on.

Slip, you're right. It should just work right away.

Best Regards,

Jimi
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,572 Posts
Good luck, wish I could just get mine to stop having siezures and rattling all over the place when I roll the windows up or down.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,937 Posts
Phil,

I have the glass out of two doors at this moment and was just thinking about the rattle too (before it happens).

I suspect it's the two felt 'squares' at the top of the inside door. After getting the glass out, one was worn down to the metal basically, but you can't see this with the glass in place with the trim and all.

It's like 1/10 of an inch of 'intact' felt 'height'. So I'm thinking it pushes the glass up against the (inside edge) exterior top trim, and the rubber part will also stretch over time.

Ken
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,963 Posts
my passenger side door never seals properly when shutting the door with the window up and both doors rattle quite heavily when they are shut with the windows down. This is one thing I would love to fix on my car. I had no idea it could be "adjusted" I jsut thought the little felt and rubber pieces were worn out. I hope you find a solution phil, as I would really like to fix mine too!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
991 Posts
I sure am glad that we didn't know this was such a problem when we pulled the glass and replaced the whole mechanical mechanism in one of Jeff's cars. Might have made us screw it up if we'd realized it was difficult. We just took it all apart put it all back together, adjusted it a bit to get it to roll up and down evenly. So far as I know, Jeff never had any issues with it after that. At least He didn't mention it. I thought it was pretty easy at the time. Hope I never need to do it again, now I'll probably screw it up big time.

Leslie
 

·
Supra since '86
Joined
·
5,472 Posts
I had this problem on my '83 passenger side also. The problem arises from years of people shutting the door by the glass, not the door itself.

It was so long ago I can't remeber exactly what I did to fix the rattle. I just remember the TSRM was not much help and I just did many adjustments over a few weeks to get it perfect.

Also the glass would not seat properly on the rubber seal when the door was closed. The one thing I do remember is changing the seal and it worked.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,374 Posts
WARNING: This is going to be a long, multi-part post but I've tried to discuss each step in detail in order to expain (I meant explain but it can be a pain too) the entire adjustment process.

Phil and all with window issues, I hope my insight, carefully absorbed by hours of head scratching, tinkering, trial & error, tear down & build up, and cycles of the window, can be of some useful help.

One special item to note: I have found that OEM Toyota glass and aftermarket replacement glass is different. Gasp, what a surprise. I’ve found that aftermarket glass can have a slightly different curvature that will not allow the window to seat properly no matter how much adjustment you try. I’ve even tried swearing at aftermarket glass. It wasn’t intimidated.

While driving and attempting to close the window does the top of the glass seem to get sucked outward thus not sealing against the rubber gasket? Then the glass guide needs adjustment (Step 5, eight). When closing the door, does the top edge of the glass pop out and not seat against the rubber gasket? Then the upper stop limit, glass angle and glass guide need to be adjusted(Steps 1, 3, 4, 5). Read them all and perform each. Changing one can affect another.

First, be certain to have the upper, exterior trim/belt moulding in place. The rubber edging on this piece affects the seated position of the glass.

Step 1:
With the glass up adjust the contact to the belt moulding. The glass has two white hooks fastened to the bottom, one near the front, one near the rear. Located along the top edge of the doorframe are the receptacles for these hooks. It become pretty self explanatory when you see it. Loosen the nuts and move these so the glass is in contact with the belt moulding when the door is closed. I found that when one of these white hooks broke the window would rattle louder than coins in a hobo’s coffee can.

Step 2:
Adjust the position of the glass, front to rear. The position is adjusted at the top of the glass guide. The glass guide is the vertical, U channel metal strip that the glass rollers run through. With the window up, loosen the two nuts located on the inside of the doorframe and slide the glass back and forth as needed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,374 Posts
Step 3:
Adjust the upper stop limit of the window in a similar fashion. Also located on the glass are two round, white disks that look like truncated cones. These similarly contact pieces (metal hook shaped items) that are also located near the top of the doorframe. With the glass up, adjust the hooks by loosening the nuts and sliding up and down. Move these a little at a time, not much is needed, if any. Constantly check the position of the glass by opening and closing the door (with glass up). The top edge of the glass should be parallel to the rubber gasket and drip rail at the roof line.

Step 4:
The angle of the glass, front to back, needs to be adjusted in conjunction with the above adjustment. The angle of the glass is adjusted by ever so slightly adjusting the angle of the equalizer arm. The equalizer is the scissor-like contraption that connects to both the glass and the inside of the doorframe. I usually find it easier to adjust the nuts on the doorframe. Lower the window about half way and loosen ONE of the nuts. Hold the glass as you loosen the nut and adjust the angle as needed, ie front higher/lower. Only a little adjustment is needed to make a big difference. If adjustment of the equalizer arm on the doorframe is not enough you will need to adjust the equalizer arm where it’s attached to the glass. If that is needed lower the glass a little more than half in order to access the two screws. Loosen only one, the front one, to adjust the angle. After you have the angle corrected check the upper stoppers again (the pieces you adjusted in Step 3).

Step 5:
Adjust the angle of the glass, inward and outward. This angle is adjusted at the top of the glass guide. The glass guide is the vertical, U channel metal strip that the glass rolls run through. When people have trouble with the glass seating properly this is usually the culprit. Using the same adjusting points as used in Step 2, loosen the nuts. At the top of the treaded stud you will see a slot. This is to allow for adjustment to the stud. Turning the stud counter-clockwise will cause the top edge of the glass to angle INWARD. Turning the stud clockwise will cause the tip edge of the glass to angle OUTWARD. Turn the stud a little at a time then retighten the nut. Test the angle by closing and opening the door and also by operating the window with the door closed. The proper angle will have the top edge of the glass contact the rubber gasket just as the door latches but not yet fully closed. Open and close the door slowly to test the contact area and timing. If the contact is correct and properly adjusted the window will touch the gasket upon first latch then push upwards and into the lip of the rubber gasket as the door is fully closed and latched. This step usually takes the most time and patience.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,374 Posts
Step 6:
The angle of the glass along the A-Pillar is adjusted by adjusting the front frame. The front frame is the black, triangular metal assembly to which the mirror is attached. Adjusting the front frame also adjusts the inward and outward angle of the glass but slightly. The front frame is attached to the doorframe via three nuts. The lower nut and stud have an adjustment capability similar to the guide. The lower stud can be turn clockwise/counter-clockwise to adjust the front angle to the glass. If the front edge of the glass is adjusted too far outward the window will not seal properly while closing. If the front edge of the glass is adjusted too far inward you will have difficulty closing the door and/or damage the rubber gasket. BE ADVISED: I have seen many of these front frame pieces with broken armatures. The front frame is attached to the door via three nuts, as mentioned earlier. It’s like an upside down triangle. The area around the two upper nuts has two extensions that connect to the lower, single stud and nut. (Sounds confusing now but will be apparent when viewing the part.) I’ve seen instances where one, sometimes both, of these extensions are broken. If broken it may make adjustment of the front angle a bit more tricky.

Step 7:
After all else is adjusted properly there’s one last item. With the window up, adjust the inner stabilizer so it touches the white, plastic plate attached to the glass. The inner stabilizer is the roller, all by itself, that is attached to the inner doorframe. The roller should just make contact with the white plate. Adjusting it too much may cause it to drag along the glass and it’s opened and closed.

IMPORTANT NOTE: Mark the starting point of each nut. Use a Sharpie marker to outline the nut and use this as a guide as to how much adjustment is needed. A small adjustment at the bottom of the glass makes a big adjust at the top edge.

Step 8:
I need a beer after writing all this.
Scott
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,963 Posts
wow! I had no idea there were that many adjustments. I suffer from all the symptoms you listed, hopefully I can get it adjusted properly. Thanks a lot, This needs to be in the FAQ!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,572 Posts
While we are on the subject of windows, how do fix the window from rattling like crazy when I roll it down? Is it as simple as removing all the door trim and tightening the bolts or does it mean that the motor is on it's way out?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,271 Posts
MkIISuperSupra said:
I sure am glad that we didn't know this was such a problem when we pulled the glass and replaced the whole mechanical mechanism in one of Jeff's cars. Might have made us screw it up if we'd realized it was difficult. We just took it all apart put it all back together, adjusted it a bit to get it to roll up and down evenly. So far as I know, Jeff never had any issues with it after that. At least He didn't mention it. I thought it was pretty easy at the time. Hope I never need to do it again, now I'll probably screw it up big time.

Leslie
exactly.
 

·
Founding Member
Joined
·
6,423 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Woohoo! Thanks for all the detail. Yes, I was not aware of at least three of those adjustments and had absolutely no idea the sequence of steps. Will try it all this weekend. Send me your address and I'll make sure get some beer. 8)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,374 Posts
Phil, send me a beer gift card. Why don’t they have those yet?

Of all those steps, you'll find that the ones you spend the most time adjusting will be the glass guide tip and the front frame. Those take a number of trys to get right. Well, at least they take me quite a while but I'm too much of a perfectionist too. The trials of being a virgo and design professional. :x

Also, don't hold me 100% to this, but I seem to remember that all the nuts and adjustable studs relating to glass adjustment points are gold in color. That may help to locate all the different areas.

I'll have to investigate the rattling with the window down. I had that once but wasn't sure exactly what was causing it. At the same time the window wouldn't seat properly when closed. After adjusting the closed position I didn't have any rattle when down. So, I'm not sure exactly which adjustment eliminated the rattle.

One thing that I have done, almost always, is to try and close the gap between the inner and outer door skins. With all the interior trim removed AND the outer trim/window belt moulding removed, stand looking downwards into the gap thru which the glass travels. In some instances I've seen that gap change in width from the back of the door, widening towards the center, then narrow again towards the front. If the gap is too wide then the outer belt moulding will not properly contact the window, leaving a gap between the rubber edging of the belt moulding and the glass. The belt moulding helps to push the glass inwards, even if ever so slightly, BUT more importantly it keeps water from entering the innards of the door. With all the trim removed I try to squeeze the inner and outer door skins together so that gap is consistent front, middle and back. It’s tough but it does work. Don’t use tools, only your hands. Also, you’re not squeezing the1/2” vertical lip that the belt moulding slips over you need to push the panel and the vertical lip. If you squeeze only the lip all that is doing is changing the angle of that lip which will change the angle of the belt moulding. Changing the angle of the belt moulding will create a gap along the bottom edge of the belt moulding and the outer door skin.

I know, some of this may sound confusing but hopefully when you’re looking at the door and all the parts my words and descriptions will become more clear than the mud they are.

If you can’t see with your eyes closed then your imagination is out of focus.
Scott
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,572 Posts
Weird, both my windows seal perfectly but anytime I roll the windows down, they rattle and squeek like crazy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,374 Posts
Gage006 said:
Weird, both my windows seal perfectly but anytime I roll the windows down, they rattle and squeek like crazy.
Brian, try lubricating the pivot points with lithium grease. All the pivot points on the horizontal equalizer arm (should be 4) plus the sliding roller in/on the equalizer arm and the EQ arm track. Additionally, lube the vertical glass guide.

Also, on that roller part of the equalizer arm check to see if the plastic roller wheel is intact. The part of the equalizer that is attached to the inner door skin has a channel in which the roller/wheel slides. If the plastic wheel is broken or disintegrated then the metal post to which the wheel is to be attached may be rattling against the EQ armature. Similarly, check to make sure the wheel in the vertical glass guide is not broken. This wheel, about the diameter of a quarter, is attached to the glass and runs thru (up and down) the glass guide. If it’s broken or chipped it too may contribute to the rattle.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,457 Posts
Wow, that is a great write up! I had to do this when I painted my car, as I pulled the glass to do it. I gave up, and took it to Toyota. They couldn't get it right and tried to tell me my frame was bent :wtf:! I finally got it right with the help of my dad and the TSRM, but boy did it take some trial and error. THis should make it much easier. I'm glad I saw this, as I'm getting ready to remove the glass again in a few weeks :)

One question though. What about the felt guides on top? Is there any way to rejuvinate them? Are they available from Toyota? Mine are so worn they've scratched the windows.

Christian
 
1 - 20 of 41 Posts
Top