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A quick little update.

When you're in the wheel wells a good thing to do is wire wheel out the stock seam sealer that joins the two halves of the main panels. Often the sealer on this seam cracks, so there's no point in waiting for it to crack, replace it ASAP.


It cracked on the DS on this car...


A crack in this seam exposes the spot welds between these 2 panels to corossion. This was hiding under the undercoating on the DS...


To fix it you need to split the two panels apart to get at the rust (and remove the rusted through section of course)...


All fixed up...


And of course you have to reseal the seam.
 

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And here we are, the last of the metal work on this car.

In this update I will cover the repair to the DS rear rocker area. I thought this side would be about the same thing as the repair to the PS with the addition of using good donor metal instead, but I was wrong. There's actually a couple valuable lessons for everyone in this update.

So this is what we're fixing today...


I figured it was a straight outer skin replacement on this side as well. Here's the thing though, I originally bought this car back in 03 with pretty much the same rust. Its been garage kept ever since. What normally happens on these cars is the outer skin rusts, and just keeps rusting, completely melting off the car and usually the frame rails underneath have just minor surface corossion on them. But with this car, the outer skin more or less stopped rusting after I got it. Inside that rocker is a rust sandwich, a whole bunch of loose rusty metal sitting in the bottom of the rocker skin and unfortuantly touching the frame rail. I didn't get a pic of the debris, but here's the rear rocker exposed...


As you can see the rail has a fair bit more rust on it then the other side. This is from sitting for so long with that rust sandwhich pressed against it. If the car had just continued to sit outside and rust, the outer skin would have just disintergrated and all that crap would have fallen out. This has happened to my daily beater, the rockers are fully exposed but in overall pretty good shape, that car should just need a new outer skin and a little grinding to be good to go.

So the lesson is, if your rocker rot looks like it did on this side, do yourself a favour and take a pick axe to your car. Seriously, open up that rocker and get all of that shit out of there. You'll do more serious damage to the car by letting it sit in there then by poking holes in the rusty areas.

On this side I also had to cut up pretty high to catch all of the inner panel rust...


While wire wheeling the end cap of the rail, I uncovered a small spot underneath the undercoating. That coupled with my suspicion that there was rot inside the frame rail meant the cap was coming off...


Yep, that definitly needs to be dealt with. Its not bad yet, but the bottom of the rail had to go to get access to it...


Now the piece I took off the bottom of the rail wasn't actually that bad, with a little sand blasting it could have been reused. But I had already committed to using my donor metal on this corner so I figured I'd just replace it. That way I could cut the donor metal a little bigger so I wouldn't have to worry about dealing with any butt welds.



Now pay close attention to that last pic. Thats what the inside of an 88,000km (56,000mile) garage queen looks like (yes those dots on the top piece are spots where the paint has given way to rust). We may have alot of moisuture up here, but I bet theres very few "rust free" cars on this forum that look any better on the inside of this piece. The weak undercoating primers they used coupled with all the leaks this corner has to deal with will rot out this piece on any car eventually. At some point, it needs to be removed, repaired or replaced, recoated and reattached. This can't be done without removing the lower section of the outer skin I'm sorry to say. If your car was truely perfect in there (which is pretty much impossible to tell), you might be able to get away with coating it with some of that wax inner panel spray, but it would still be a gamble in my book.

Here's all the pieces I harvested off the donor metal or fabricated to repair this corner (the little 90degree bent patch was for the prior update).


Lets get busy. The car is cleaned up and prepared...


On goes the lower rocker panel...


Then the end cap (which is half the origial piece and half donor metal as the donor cap wasn't complete)...


And now we seal it all up before the outer skin goes on. Its a little hard to see, but I've actually added 3 access holes via hole saw to the lower rail piece I removed so that I can treat the back sides of all the areas I've welded...


And last, on with the outer skin (sealer on here too)...


Quick test fit with the flare...


And its good! Minimal bodywork required here, just the way I like it.

More sealer! Don't take chances, seal up all of the exposed seams, not just the ones we've opened up. They could all be problems someday...


Its always a challenge getting at the seams in the panel after the outer skin is on...


Like on the other side, I ended up using some of that wax interior panel spray to try and fully coat all of the areas I couldn't access directly with seam sealer. If you look at the 2nd last pic you'll notice I added an access hole in the interior section to the top of the rail so I could spray some of that wax into the rails boxed in section. I then plugged the hole with a spare oem body plug.

Oh, a little word of caution when using that wax spray. Never add it till you're done the welding and never use it on an area that you may weld on one day. Its wax, yeah, it burns, it burns really good :eek4dance:

And thats it, this bitch is officially RUST FREE :D There will be a couple more updates to cover the undercoating and bodywork, along with a final before and after montage, stay tuned!
 

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You have my vote for the most informative body post I've ever seen. If you could could you give a bit of info on the type of welder you used and perhaps show a sample of you drilling out the factory sheet layer welds?

Great Job, thanks so much!
 

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Thanks for the compliment! I'll address your post in a second there...


I havn't detailed Door repair in this thread yet and probably won't for awhile as this car is about to go back into storage so I'll just through a quick blurb on the subject out right now.

Fixing rusty doors sucks as the inner skin is only pressed in by the edges of the outer skin, and the inner sheet metal is very curvy and hard to reproduce and patch nicely. The doors rust because there is no sealer on the insides of them where the inner skin touches the outer. The doors constantly have water passing through them (as the outer seal that presses against the glass never seals perfectly, if it all when they're old and dry) so it gets in between these 2 panels along with dirt and can very quickly rust the door from the inside out. IMO its best to find some rust free doors, clean the insides of them out perfectly, perhaps let some rust converter sit in this seam, then clean and degrease and lay a bead of seam sealer inside the door to fill in the seam. Just becareful to poke out the drains before the stuff hardens. I will detail all of this with pictures at some point in the future.
 

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You have my vote for the most informative body post I've ever seen. If you could could you give a bit of info on the type of welder you used and perhaps show a sample of you drilling out the factory sheet layer welds?

Great Job, thanks so much!
Just wait for the other rust thread I'm working on (its a little ways away yet however), it will be REALLY informative. There's alot I didn't post as I didn't want to clog this thread up too much as its also a build thread on DeanFun's car.

Nothing fancy for the welder, its a 110v Mig. However, it has infinitly variable dials for the heat and wire speed. IMO this is ESSENTIAL for bodywork as you're always trying to adjust your wire speed to the exact point where your welds become perfect flat little pools of molten metal. When I adjust this thing trying to dial it in, you can't even see the dial turn as I adjust it so little to get it to that perfect sweet spot.

I don't have any pics of me actually drilling, but I don't think it would really help any. Basically you want to get one of these bits...


They're like a little hole saw specifically designed for drilling out spot welds. Once you drill through the outer layer, the spot welds underneath should look like it does on this panel here...


You have to stop often to make sure you don't drill too deep into the underlayer. These bits are replacable and reversable, the hole saw section screws off the die and you can buy replacements in packs (they're not cheap though). I've gone through about 2 full bits on this job, they get pretty useless when they're dull. You also need to punch the center of where you're going to drill really well. If you can't get a good deep punch mark, drill a small pilot hole into the first layer of metal.

You should be able to find these at any parts store that sells alot of real bodyshop supplies.
 

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Alright, time to finish this up! My work is done on his project for now, but I've been too busy to post the updates. Let's take care of a couple loose ends first.

I amended the hatch update post, with this extra bit...

Its also extremely important to seal up the inner ridge around the glass. The inner and outer hatch skins are spot welded together on this ridge, and are not sealed on either side. When these spot welds start to rust its usually the begining of the end for a hatch, rust around the glass is very hard to fix properly. I added 2 more holes to be able to seal the bottom ridge completely on the inside...


And then sealed the ridge on the glas side all the way around...



I also added a pic of the inner DS rear quater all sealed in to the appropriate post...
 

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Next up is probably the single most important step to preserving these cars, the undercoating stage. A good undercoating job on top of what the factory did (which was less then adequate) is essential to these cars survival, and unfortunately it can't be done properly with the gas tank installed so any aftermarket or dealer job your car received is not enough. There are several areas on the underside that desperately need to be coated as they only have a thin coating of paint protecting them from rusting, and that paint is not enough in such a harsh environment. There are also many seams that are completely unprotected.

Once the underside is fully stripped down to the body (its best to undercoatwith the rear subframe removed too, but can be done with it installed), everything that’s going to be coated needs to be scrubbed clean and degreased. I won't lie, this isn't much fun to do without a hoist. Do it on your drive way with a power washer and in your bathing suit if you can. Get the car up as high as possible and go to town. I used a type of thinner called Tumbler to degrease after scrubbing with engine degreaser, solvent and soap and water. Stick to the engine bay solvent, foam or gel, for any areas that already have undercoating you don't want to remove, as the solvent and tumbler will dissolve it and make a mess.

Once clean, it’s very important to once again bust out the seam sealer and seal any exposed seams as you don't want to chance the final coat of undercoating to not fully seal them for you. Have a look at the places I hit...



Note the bottom seam on the beam that is spot welded to the spare tire well, I left that alone. That beam is not boxed in, its just angle iron, the opposite side is open. Because of this water will get into it and there isn't access to seal the seam on the inside where it is spot welded to the spare tire well. So don't seal the underside of that seam as you want that water to be able to drain.


Here's another faux pas. On the right is one of the panels for the rear seat belt holes that we addressed in an earlier post, but above it is the back plate for the rear seat backs middle post. Again, no sealer. I bet you many cars will have rust under that plate. I didn't see any signs of it on this car so I chanced it and sealed it in. Exposed steel does need some kind of air supply to continue oxidizing so any rust that was already there "should" not be able to get any worse, but it would be best to remove this plate on rustier cars. And almost as bad, the entire floorpan above the diff has no undercoating at all.


Here's a couple uber important spots. The upper spring mounts are rust magnets, they need to be sealed up like this. I put a lot of work into removing surface rust in these areas. Also, the section of steel that braces the outer edge of the spring cage onto the rail is a design that is highly susceptible to rusting out. Its hard to see in this pic, but the cavity above this brace needs to be fully seam sealed as well as what’s visible here.

Any area with red paint is a place that just had a single coat of primer that I laid on (most likely because surface rust had started and I had to grind it off). I like to put down a coat of primer and paint on bare metal before I under coat for maximum rust protection and adhesion. You also want to let that paint cure over night before you hit it with the undercoating. Speaking of, now its time. However, I don’t actually use undercoating. I can’t stand the stuff personally. I don’t like how it goes on, I don’t like how it drips off after spraying, and I don’t care for how it levels out when it dries. Not to mention that solvents dissolve it and it can’t be painted (which means you can’t use it on the inner edges of the quarters). So I prefer to use black rocker guard instead. I find it much easier to work with, its plenty tough enough and it looks fantastic. Have a look at the completed underside…







Here I’ve reattached the brackets for the gas tank and they’ve been sand blasted and POR15ed, as have the exhaust hanger brackets (prev pic). Also, the plastic coating on the ends of all the fuel lines visible here had degraded and were starting to rust. I stripped off the rest of the plastic bits, wire brushed them down, rust treated them and then POR15ed them. I should also mention that the ProFoam seam sealer I like is available in black as well and would have been a better choice for the underside. The rocker guard tends to recede away from the edges of the sealer a touch, hence why you see the odd white bit here and there.

The main floor pan (the under seat areas) is well exposed so the standard dealer undercoating was pretty good and there wasn’t much for exposed seams. I touched up a few areas but nothing major. However, I did fix one of my biggest pet peeves. I can’t stand when people jack Toyotas up with anything but the factory spare tire jacks on the rocker sills. Any hydraulic jack or car hoist will crush the rocker sill if jacked there, but unfortunately its almost impossible to find an old car that hasn’t been severally damaged in these areas by ignorant mechanics over the years. I don’t have any before pics, but I spent a couple hours pounding and prying the rocker sill back to its original shape on both sides, and then some sanding, rust treatment, primer, seam sealing and rocker guarding of course…



And that’s it for this update, I will make my final post another night this week.
 

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Final Update for the Rust Repair Stage

Ok, its finely time for all of the post bodywork shots (see the prior post for the undercoating stage), and I'll do a before\after comparison plus links to each repair's post. The bondo work is complete and everything has a good coat of acid etch primer on it (which is waterproof, sandable primer is porus). However we're going to save the wetsanding and primer work on all of the repaired areas for the paint prep stage, whenever that will be. So there's several passes of wetsanding and reprimering with high build primer to be done yet to everything you're about to see, so please keep that in mind. Also the car has been partially assembled and prepared for long term storage so all of the holes have been temporaly sealed with electrical tape. There's no point in fully reassembling it as it will be painted the next time it comes out. Alright, here we go...

Hatch





The shaved antenna is pictured here as well.

Spare Tire Well




Rear Valance Panel Corners





The repairs to all of these areas was covered in one post here...
http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?p=633757#post633757

Rear Seatbelt middle holes


(this pic was posted before, we won't be painting the interior areas till the paint color has been decided)


http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?p=641558#post641558

Top of Rear Wheel Well




http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?p=642213#post642213

Inner Rear Wheel Well Wall





http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?p=644086#post644086

Left Rear Quater




http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?p=639187#post639187

Right Rear Quater




http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?p=639187#post639187

Left Front Quater (rear rocker)



The primer on the door was from a rust bubble that was hiding under the impact strip. There was no point in covering that in a post, simple stuff, grind, treat, bodywork, primer, done.

http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?p=649070#post649070

Right Front Quater




http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?p=646623#post646623


And thats it. I'll close with some wet glamour shots of the car, primer and electrical tape, hot!



I've found a straight rust free door for this side so I didn't bother fixing all of the dents, I just ground off the spots where the paint had cracked and surface rust was starting. Hence the "primer bandaids"


Thanks for reading! Feel free to post any comments. One day we'll bump this thread with the car all painted and shiny, one day :)

**Updates!**
The car is back in the shop to be completed. But we may have found a couple more things to do to it before paint...

1jz Swap...
http://www.celicasupra.com/forums/showthread.php?54173-Let-s-do-this-slowly-(Canadian-85P-restore)&p=801253#post801253

Sunroof Work :)
http://www.celicasupra.com/forums/showthread.php?54173-Let-s-do-this-slowly-(Canadian-85P-restore)&p=807353#post807353
 

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Awesome work and a great post....

thanks!
 

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I am doing it again, 2 more times at least, though one of the cars has very little rust so it should be a quicky.

I don't know how long I will be doing this for, its kind of an interm thing while I get my other company off the ground and I may be taking a regular job for awhile instead. However I may end up being able to do another couple mk2s this year. Basically I charge 25 bucks an hour. The bill can vary a lot based on how much rust there is. Figure at least 5k for just the metal work, then it can go up quite a bit from there if the car is fairly bad. It can be less if theres alot less rust. I personally wouldn't recomend fixing one thats alot rustier though, find a better chassis in that case. I'm painting the next car as well so that obviously will be more, but the paint work is pretty minimal compared to the metal work (about half the cost). I deal with a local bodyshop with a really nice modern booth for the actual painting. I've painted enough cars myself to know that a guy who does it every day will do a much better job, plus I don't want to deal with the fumes in my neighborhood, so I outsource the spraying. However having a fully prepped and masked car painted at a shop can be fairly cheap. Unfortunately the only shops that do this kind of metal work are restoration specialists, and unfortuantly you may have trouble finding ones that will be willing to take on a Japanese unibody car.
 

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Your prices for the work are pretty solid! $25/hour is still on the the pretty low side! I know a few backyard setups that are $50+ an hour.

Do you replace the pieces you hole cut out after treating the inside?

Do you like to block by hand or with a nice big air board?
 

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Thanks.

No I don't replace them, that would defeat the purpose. If I patched the holes, I'd have to add more access holes to get at the backs of the new welds. I only put the access holes in places that are covered up by other panels or interior bits, and I do debur and paint the edges of course. Then I pop in some black plastic body hole plugs. Body supply shops carry them in common imperial hole sizes (3/8, 1/2, 3/4 inch etc).

I block by hand.

Its looking right now like I will be doing this for the rest of summer at least. I just started on the american 86 car that looks rust free that I mentioned earlier. I'll throw a thread up on it when I get some time.
 

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Boy, cryptic post for like everyone but me lol. I did actually post a thread on that subject once upon a time here.

You should post a little update as to whats happened to this car since it was last updated. I've got a good pic of the new addition if you need it.
 

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Discussion Starter #58
It is probably time for an update.

The last time we spoke... almost three years ago, the first big run at bodywork for the car was completed by Seamus (excellently documented in this thread). And then... nothing.

The car sat idle until October of 2010, when a for sale ad in Victoria, BC came up on a little Canadian-Toyota forum called Dorikaze. It was a beautiful two-tone 84 Mk2 with about 70% of a 1JZ swap. It had a few goodies already - griffin rad, lm-1 and auxbox, silicone rad hoses, 2jz-converted waterpump, some sort of aftermarket downpipe (megan?), modded ma61 crossmember using stock 1jz mounts, konig rewinds on great rubber, and a nice R154 sitting behind it. The owner indicated there was "a bunch of other stuff" I could grab as well. He was selling to get some money together to go to school. A noble cause. A price was agreed upon, and a plan started to come together. Buying cars sight-unseen from 16hrs away is no simple task. It was decided to make an adventure out of it. I would fly down to the coast for a week, and in that time Seamus and I would find a truck, head to Vancouver Island, rent a trailer, bring the car back, de-1JZ it, return the car to stock and get it ready to sell.

Unfortunately, that's not the dumbest car scenario I've come up with. Between buying a FJZ80 sight-unseen from Vancouver island, grabbing the MS75 Crown out of a farmers field (the most ridiculous), to agreeing to a 2,500km road trip in an 84 BJ42 that had not been driven in the past five years (also from Vancouver island), I am not a paragon of rational thinking. Anyways...

Relatively speaking, everything went smoothly. Unless Seamus has some of his own, this is pretty much the only picture of the car that I have.



We arrived on a Sunny weekend morning in Victoria to pick up the car and discovered that the owners "bunch of other stuff" was in fact a pickup-load of mechanical and electrical bits. Most of a 4a-ge, most of a 7m-gte swap, a bunch of 5m-ge parts, a brand new 12x20 car tent, a hood, and... who knows what else. Score!



Back on the mainland, the car was de-1JZ'd as planned, and a perfectly acceptable 5m-ge put in its place. The car was sold a few weeks later, and I'm pretty sure the owner is on the forum. Hi! The 1JZ slipped into the 85 and the whole thing was rolled into the newly erected 12x20 tent. And that's where it's been for the last two years.

I've decided, seeing as to how 2013 will be my tenth year of owning supras, that I should really get off my ass and get this thing done. The car has been awakened from its slumber and wheeled into Seamus' garage once again to finish off the last of the bodywork and prep for paint. I'll be taking a month off work to finish the car off, with the goal of it making the 1,600km trip back to Northern Alberta in the spring. Orders have been placed with George @ Raptor Racing and Mark @ Vancouver Toyota for a whole list of fun toys...

  • belt and bodyside moldings
  • shift boot
  • differental seals and bearings
  • battery bracket & hardware
  • windshield trim
  • T3 camber plates and top hats
  • AGX adjustables for the front
  • Poly rear subframe, crossmember, and control arm bushings
  • poly steering rack bushings
  • fender flare trim
  • V2 short shifter
  • BBK slotted/drilled rotors, pads, lines, and bias adjuster
Still to be obtained is a Truetrac, intercooler and piping, and driveshaft. Soon enough...
 

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Excellent! nice score by the way. Can't wait to read the some more on this.
 
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