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Discussion Starter #1
I'm cc'ing this from the yahoo mailing list and would likesome feedback...

<quote>
since phpBB2 is built on the PHP scripting language, it wouldn't be *that* difficult to integrate a digest (or individual emails). The biggest hurdle to overcome is to get your replies to the correct place in the message board. which would entail a mail robot placing incoming emails into the database after numerous security checks. I would imagine the subject line would have to be quite specific for the robot to be able to determine which database and fields to place the info in.

I know Mike has the mail() function, but a mail robot will be needed too.

If anyone is interested in a Dev team, I'm game, but this will take quite some time and A LOT of details to iron out.

but this would give the best of both worlds.

Mike
(I'll cc this to the forum and we'll see what comes of it.)
----- Original Message -----
From: Ross Petracci
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 7:42 AM
Subject: Re: new forum was Re: [mk2] You guys rock!


I don't know.
Everyone says the problem is that we're all spread out.
I think we're all here, but are being spread out.
In 10 minutes, I can download all the email (I use email, not the yahoo
interface, which I agree sucks.) and read at my lesiure. I can even be
disconnected from the internet.
Yahoo has a web based interface, and email.
All I want is email, even a digest.
That shouldn't be too hard, should it?
If Mike and Stephen could set that up, then that would end my whingeing, and
I'd happily leave yahoo.

Ross
</quote>
 

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I've got a PDA that I like to download email too. Like this guy said its real easy to then browse through things and reply when offline.
But that was because yahoo was simply text based and had limits. Its so first generation internet.
Welcome to 2003.

This forum style is the same one all the major sites use.

Instead of crabbing (or whining as he says, and I know he means it jokingly) about how things aren't "the way I'd like them to be", I am more grateful that someone has taken the time to move this group forward to offer a modern forum. Its not like our MkII's are jumping off the shelves like civics and accords. In fact they are headed to the crushers. No one (like a car company or auto product) is going to spend money on us, we have to do it ourselves. So again I am just thankful that someone took the time to do it.

When are you (Mike) going to setup a paypal button to offer donations? Bandwidth does cost something and I am willing to make a donation to keep us off yahoo.

I wouldnt worry about changing things to much to please one person or a group of people. If they are supra fanatics than they will gravitate to where the best mkII forum is and quickly this will become it.

Change is harder for some people and I think this is all you are receiving. As soon as they learn/figure out/see what is possible in this forum with messaging, replying, picture posting, html code again this will quickly become the place for MKII enthusiasts.

Ok now, where is the women section???
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I would have to agree. it is hard for the human race to immediately accept change. I think eventually most, if not everyone, will come over to the forum. I talked a while back with Mike about this and he made the very good point of needing an "adjustment period".

Eventually, I'm sure Mike will remove the yahoo group mailing list link from CS.com, then all the newbies won't even have heard of the yahoo mailing list.

I agree we'll need to be patient and let people adjust at their own speed, but like the majority of people are saying, it is time to join the 21st century.

Like I said in the mail to the list, I would post this and see what comes of it. If there isn't enough interest, then there is no reason to start tearing phpBB2 apart and adding all the email stuff, although, it would be a neat option to have.

We DO need to watch our signatures though. that is the ONE biggest thing that slows SF.com down!!! some text or maybe a Very small pic. ( I think quick's idea of a "small banner" would be more than plenty.

my 2 cents worth...
 

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Consider the additional bandwidth required to do what you say -- where would the money come from to pay for that?

One thing to consider: suggestions are not demands.

What I mean is that Mike and Sidman are allowed to say "can't do it now, sorry" or even "I don't want to do that" because they put in the time to create this forum.

In the three days of it's operation it is already more successful than the MkII section at Supraforums.com
 

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Webber: thanks for your input, I do appreciate it.

Here is an email I sent to Yahoo list.


All this roundy round talk. Ill keep it simple, and please debate my points
if necessary. This is not directed to just you Webber, and there is not
hate or crap talk here.

1. mk2 list was controversial when it broke off SOGI. After a month the
mk2 community was SO happy that they did it. I never looked back, it was a
necessary step.

2. We got a ton of great people together on yahoo list.

3. Did you know Yahoo list was established in 1998?! Yes 5 years ago.
That is when Yahoo list was good, not slow, buggy or full of POS ads. It
was also free and adequate. Free is key here folks. Most people setup
Yahoo lists cause they are free, and do not have time to do anything else.

4. I stepped up, and make a mk2 FAQ on Geocities. Remember that old heads?
http://www.geocities.com/dust_inc/mkiifaq.htm
Then, I really stepped up, paid $ and a shit load of time to make cs.com.
Rob Boeck also helped me out a lot, as I would write countless pages of
notes as I sat in boring MIS classes in college. When I didnt have any more
time to put them on the web, I would send his those pages and he typed them
up, and emailed me the text. He helped me out a bit, and I appreciated
that. I did the best job I could, and I think its ok. If I had more
contributions, it would be better.

5. Its 2003, and Yahoo sucks for the reasons in #3. We cant complain
though, cause its free. Also, there has been no moderation for many years.
I thank Matti and Helene for setting it up 5 years ago, but we need to move
on since this Yahoo is not the Yahoo they setup.

6. cs.com is paid for, and the new forum software is free. All I pay for
is hosting space, and Sidman and I put time into making it work. He is the
tech dude (back end), I handle all the politics and the public html. It
works well, I think.

7. People use supraforums as a basis for web forums. Bad move cause sf.com
is overloaded, buggy, and full of trolls. We will NOT have those issues on
cs.com.

8. This new cs.com forum is way faster than sf.com, and will not have troll
issues. If the random troll makes it over (unlikely cause no one aside from
us cares about mk2s) they will be gone fast.

8. Why were there tons of mk2 posts on sf.com? Why where there even a few
on isupra.com? Cause they got tired of the inadequate yahoo list. The
majority of guys who remained on the Yahoo list did so cause sf.com was slow
as a dog, and it wanst worth their effort, and we didnt get any love there.

9. Now, I have a fast forum, located on the Mk1, Mk2 supra homepage, that
has a bunch of unique categories for ONLY mk1/2 cars! That is ideal, and
that is what most car forums have on the web.

10. I do not see any integration with a mailing list in the future. Why go
and assemble a dev team, modify forum software that works well, spend a
buncha time to make a hybrid mailing lisr/web forum and create all sorts of
drama/hassle?? This makes no sense to me. With cs.com forum, it may force
a few peeps to change, and try it. Once they try it, i can assure the LARGE
majority will like it and probably stay. If a few people have to change,
thats ok. Change is good. I know not everyone will be happy with me, but
if the majority is, I am happy.

Can you guys not suck it up, forget all the "Malloy has the upper hand and
is trying to get his own way and start his virtual mk2 empire' BS and just
humor me here? I put a LOT of time into this community, and I would like to
think my hustling of cs.com has helped the image of our cars online and
brought a solid community together. You would not believe how many people
look at the gallery...and cs.com now. Im talking 25 times the hits I used
to get 2 yrs ago. You had to see the hits after the Vegas meet...just nuts.
Those stickers also work very well..and I thank everyone for running them.
Esp Don L, with his attention magnet, race wining autox car ;)

PS: Unlike Yahoo/Matti Helene: Sidman and I are yapping on AIM and working
on the site alll the time. That is not a knock to Matti/H since they took
tons of time to build the most comprehensive Toyota web site out there.
But, topic is mailing list vs forum.

Mike
 

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I just don't understand why anyone who has been on the list for any length of time would think you're trying to build some kind of empire...

...they must really:
a) not know you
b) be looking for a conspiracy
c) have too much time on their hands
d) all of the above

I suspect 'd'.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
alrighty, this I'll post this here, and then I'm really gonna leave this alone... there's no use for me to keep it going when apparently there are other people ready, willing, and able to gime Mike and Steven a hard time.

I'll say this... I like the new forum and don't see the need for a mailing list added to screw up the works.... I do know of all the pro's and cons, costs, etc to my post about mail integration, read on for more info....

here's the quote from the mailing list, from now on, 90+% of my posts will be to the forum. for the sake of space, bandwidth, reading it Again.. refer to the "roundy roundy" post by MM.

<quote>
oh, and I do thank you and applaud you for all the hard work and dedication to the MKII and pertinent information, It shows in your website and your commitment to it and the website.

Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: MK2Supra (mwebber)
To: [email protected]
Cc: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 3:05 PM
Subject: Re: [mk2] hopefully the last cs.com forum thread...


well, I'll guess I'll say my last piece on this subject, stay civil and let this whole subject go since it's obviously a current flame-fest in progress....

I didn't say ""Malloy has the upper hand and
is trying to get his own way and start his virtual mk2 empire' "

I said..."weither Mike M means to or not, he does pretty much have the upper hand since he runs the foremost MKII website. (that's how I found the mailing list)"

You DO have the foremost MKII site, you ARE the one most people look to for MKII info, some people will always be unhappy with anything you do, some will worship the ground you walk on... that's just life.

maybe I could have worded it a bit better.... maybe not... but I have never said(and never will) you are starting your own MKIIdom or MKII Empire.... it's obvious that you are getting hate(disgruntled, etc) mail about the switch and are sensitive to the subject... and Write This In The Sky "I, Michael Webber, prefer the forum as it is".

In the same email I said all that, I also congratulated you and Steven for putting together a kick-ass, and well thought plan (which I know you've been tossing around for some time, because you and me talked about it about a year ago).

I posted about the mail integration because I've heard more than one person talking about it on the mailing list.... its a free country... so I posted it, I knew the answer already, that's one huge undertaking, and reliability issues, mail server load... etc...etc....etc....etc.... but it didn't "hurt" to offer and see what came of it.

Mike
</quote>
 
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