[NiGHTS]

OK, I've been doing a bit of searching for running rich symptoms...some terms/words that keep popping up in reference to it are: Fuel Pressure Regulator, AFM connections, Cold Start Injector/Sensor/Valve, Coolant Temp Sensor and Leaky Fuel Injectors.

Just wondering, if someone would be kind enough to point out where each of these items are in the engine...and if there are ways to check whether or not they are faulty...and how to check?

Thanx heaps.

 

[Dave A.]

The fuel pressure regulator is located on the fuel rail near the firewall on the drivers side. Try disconnecting and plugging the vacuum hose and go for a spin and see what happens.

 

[Dave A.]

Ooops! I forgot that you have RHD in Aus.. FPR would be on the passengers side, not the drivers side.

 

[Dave A.]

If the injectors are leaking down then the mixture should get more rich at idle when you disconnect the vacuum hose on the FPR.

 

[NiGHTS]

The fuel pressure regulator is located on the fuel rail near the firewall on the drivers side. Try disconnecting and plugging the vacuum hose and go for a spin and see what happens.

Ok, lol...where and what is the firewall?

When you say fuel rail, are you talking down below, like below the throttle body or...?

 

[Speed Racer]

The metal in the body that separates the engine bay from the cockpit (in American terms anyway) is called the "firewall". It's what the brake master cylinder, clutch master cylinder, wiper motor etc are all attached to.

The part of the body just behind the engine. Dashboard is on the other side of it.

 

[Dave A.]

The fuel rail is located below the throttle body and is secured to the intake manifold runner assembly. The FPR is mounted on the fuel rail at the very back of the rail, round cylinder shaped device about 2-3 inches long and has a vacuum hose connected to the top of it. Try disconnecting that hose while the engine is idling and see if perhaps a small amount of fuel comes out of the top of the FPR while the engine is idling. If you see fuel, the diaphragm in the FPR is shot. Page FI-50 in the 83 TSRM. Also, if the FPR leaks when you disconnect the hose, shut everything down to avoid creating a fire!!

 

[NiGHTS]

Hmm, it seems my FPR doesn't have a hose which I can take off. It only has a metal pipe attached to it, which can't be removed...weird. So I guess there is no way of telling if it's leaking or broken...

I need to change my Fuel Filter and Air Filter because they haven't been changed in years. I don't think they'll make any difference though.

 

[Dave A.]

That is weird! Are you sure there isn't a hose right on top of the FPR? Maybe you're confusing the FPR with the pulsation damper that is round and has a plastic cap on top?

 

[NiGHTS]

I looked along the fuel rail and the only thing that was coming off it was at the end and facing downwards...it was a cylinder type shape with only a metal pipe running off it...located near the firewall...no plastic hoses...

I'm assuming this is the FPR...I couldn't see anything else which matches it's description attached to the fuel rail. Maybe the 5M-E FPR is a little different to the 5M-GE one?

What now?

 

[moon]

look under nieth that one. its kinda hard to see...sorta under nieth the injector rail...

 

[Dave A.]

Page 4-21 in the Haynes manual. Illustration 19.9a shows the FPR located in the center of the fuel rail on a bracket. I forgot that you have the 5M-E and not the 5MGE. My bad! 8)

 

[FreaK]

after reading thriough this post, I can say only a little - my 5M-E equipped '81 MA47 smells kinda wierd as well, but that is a timing/mixture thing - as well as running 94RON Alky-gas and high-flow exhaust. I also have only one of the original 2 cat's in there, and it's most likely burnt out. From the stock downpipe the exhaust is bolted to a 2.75" custom-bent pipe that goes back to (previously) my hand-built SuperTrapp-style straight through "muffler", which was just stolen the other night. Now I have a Flomaster "Original 40" dual-outs "muffler" on it, and I will also be retuning the system.

Poor mileage might well be a combination - without the 02 then the 'puter needs to be TOLD what it should do - unless you have the only MAP in Toyota existence lol.

Poor mileage - do the air filter, fuel filter, adjust the valve lash, set the timing, and run a tank of leaded or lead-replacement through. I have mine timed up a little, with in/ex set at 8/12 (thou) and it is strong and nets 25-30MPG combined, even with my lead foot.

I expect that when the exhaust work was done, for the previous exhaust, the amount of backpressure changed and the 'puter was not re-tuned, also it may not have been set for the difference in fuels from leaded to non.

I heve (Canadian) manuals for the 5M-E as well as early Celicas, so I can try to digitize anything pertinant and send it to you if that might help!

 

[NiGHTS]

Hmm...well this week I will be hopefully changing the fuel and air filter...I'll see if it makes any difference.

It feels like no matter what I do though, this smell well never go away.

FreaK, has your 5M-E ever run rich before? If so, what did you do to correct it? The blackness inside my muffler and the poor milage have got me convinced it's running rich...and that's probably why it smells...least I'm hoping anyway. :?

I'm about to go do the little check Dean just told me about for the Fuel Pressure Regulator.

One last question. What effect would the TPS being in the wrong position have on the car? I want to adjust it and see if it changes anything, but I'm scared I might bugger something up in the ECU in the process...

 

[FreaK]

Coo.

yah, the FPR is kinda right below the Throttle Body. And I dont think you reall need to worry at all about having the cooland pass through the T/B mate - warm there... verrah warm.

As to setting up the TPs, I'm not going to say how I did it - apparently I'm a little "out there" in how I do things (by ear/eye) so I'll say to go look it up in FAQ's or bug the doods on Toymods - there IS a definate way to measure and adjust the TPS, I just don't know it yet.

Yes, my tailpipe ahd been blackenned, but I did all of the above, and now my car is far enough away from stock that little things make a bigger difference.
Poor sparkplugs can cause you to go rich somehow, but poor airflow or a choked exhaust are killer for it.

Just do a general tuneup, and see what happens, I expect you will be surprised! Saying you ahvent done and airfilter in 2years... woo00ooo

ok I can't resist - if you want to know whatup, Take the cover off the TPS and see what it does - there should be lil fingers that the cam action on the throttle plate shaft bend, and they should be ;
idle
off idle
wot

the 'puter will take these into account when setting the fuel, and i set mine (with NO slack in the throttle actuator) to drop off the idle setting into the next phase JUST as you touch the gas pedal.

2 cents canadian

 

[NiGHTS]

Cool

Ok, I think I understand about the TPS now...well, I get the general idea anyway...

I figure with the things I have changed so far to try and correct the problem, it would equate to around 70% of a tune-up. The only things I know which haven't been replaced in a very long time are the fuel and air filter. But I've checked the air filter and it seems to be fine. I'm still going to change it though regardless. But how bad would an air filter have to be before it starts affecting the car?

I ran the car at idle with the air filter and noted the RPM etc...then I took it out to see if it would make any difference but it didn't...what does that mean? That it's fine or bad? I figured a way you could tell if the air filter is bad is if you put it in and there is a drop in RPM. But I don't know.

Someone show me a photo of a dirty/clogged filter so I can compare...

Thanx

 

[FreaK]

easiest way to check an airfilter is to go fro a drive with it in, then take it out, all while watching a vacuum guage.

I swapped to the '82 bigger-body AFM, and I dunno if you can do that, but it allowed me to clamp on a K&N style oiled-cotten filter.

WAAAY more flow than a paper wow.

Anyway - try to get some kind of guage on it - the load at idle is so small it's almost irrelevant.

On my car I have ZERO inches of vacuum at WOT all the way up to 5800rpms.

BTW - you got valve clatter? Loose rockers can really eat power/mileage...

 

[NiGHTS]

Oh ok...hmm...I'll see if I can measure it properly then...is it wise to drive around without the filter though? :shock:

Valve clatter? You mean is there any noise coming from under the valve cover? No, not that I can tell...the engine sounds fine and there is no abnormal sounds coming from it...I haven't adjusted or checked the valve clearance though...it's such a hassle taking that cover off...argh!

What sorts of other things should I be doing for a tune-up?

P.S Are you from Aussie?

 

[FreaK]

Nope! Ontario Canada. I get to deal with all the weather you'll never see!
Like +20C to -10C in one day... waking up to your car in a snowdrift, +35C in summer... -30C in winter ... so the systems here take a beating and need fairly constant tweaking in the older stuff.

and "hassle"? pop off your intake, as a unit! pull out the spark wires, move the heater hose and away you go! lol.

My version of a "tune up" includes;
oil change with filter (I use Castrol Syntex 5-50 and Teflon filter)
Air Filter (they are cheap, not worth leaving in too long)
Fuel filter once a year
Trans oil dump/refil, filter if avail for automatic
Diff oil check/service
Valve lash adjust
Timing check adn adjust
Coolant test/flush/fill
THERMOSTAT once a year if there is ANY indication it MIGHT be bad
** hell you dont even need it - just fab a plate same thickness as the thermostat body with a 5/8 inch or 3/4inch hole in the middle and put that in instead... **
Check over all hoses/lines/GROUNDS
Ignition parts check/test - spark wires/cap/rotor, replace as needed.

Now I'm not saying ot do this every week, but when something is *obviously* wrong, I prefer to do everything I CAN to get things right....

There's a slim chance that you are runnign too *much* fuel pressure, so I'm assuming several systems slightly out of whack.

How you are are going to check for stoich (proper mix) without an O2 sensor or an EGT I dunno, but you will notice better behaviour if you make things right, I am certain! As much as I like the twin cam engines, these 2.8 SOHCs are a beut.. and even with my auto I chirp the 225's shifting second on a warm day!

But for now I must off to bed.. 'tis Drift Day tomorrow and the guys from Signal auto are coming with their Sylvias! w00t!
[url]http://www.driftnation.com/events/signal03.html [/url]

 

[NiGHTS]

Oh ok...

Big hello all the way out to Canada then. I love the canadian accent btw.

A lot of those tune up things I have recently done. I guess finding a single solution to running rich isn't possible...sounds like it's a culmination of a number of things...D'oh!

I'll figure it out one day I hope...

Thanx for all the input anyway...If I make any discoveries i'll keep you posted.