[Deanfun]

okay, so:

get in today, start the car, let it warm up, everything is tickety boo.


put it into 1st, drive out of parking lot... coast to stop sign. put it into neutral to stop. start out again, rev up, let off gas and put in clutch to shift. engine dies.

i coast to teh side of the road, try cranking it... won't start, cranks, but won't start. pop hood, check fluids - oil, brake, clutch, all good. no major leaks under the car, no bad smoke or smells. air filter dry, distributor and plugs/wire dry.

i give it a couple minutes, then try cranking it again. evnetually it starts. goes to idle. i tap the gas a few times, bring it up to 2000rpm roughyl, let it drop to idle. it stays alive. put it into gear and pull out. turn left and start accelerating. clutch in, gas out, engine dies before i get into 2nd. after waiting some more, and cranking it, it eventuially starts.

i let it sit at idle for a few seconds... and then the rpms start jumping all over the place ebtween 500 and 1500 rpm. it gets all rough, slowly dropping (while still spiking and jumping) until it dies.

basically, i can't get it to stay started... sounds likea fuel issue, the way it dies. my dad (mechanic), my step mom (engine parts sales) and one of my buddies (restoring a 73 240z, L28, triple weber 45's), all figure it's fuel related. fuel filter is most likely. when it gets wild idling, it feels like what happens when a car runs out of gas basically.

i figure the reason it died int he middle of shifting is becuase when i let off the gas, not enough pressure, or shear volume, of fuel was gfetting through at the idle setting becuase the fuel filter is toast, so it died.

it was raining, and cars were goign by, so i couldn't hear if the fuel pump was still priming when you turn the key to on. i can't hear it inside the car normally anways, so i have to get someohe to listen for me.

basically,t eh car is sitting at UBC, i took my girlfriends car home tonight, but i NEED that fuckign car fixed. i may have 4, but it's the only running one. as it stands, i'm buying a fuel filter regardless, and taking al my tools in to fix the damn thing tomorrow... in her residence parking lot.

any other ideas... am i missing anything?

ps: i've also seen it, very rarely, while driving it will hiccup once or twice, as if it loses fuel... but it literally has happened 2 or 3 times in about 2 weeks of driving 60km+ per day.

 

[MkIISuperSupra]

I wouldn't rule out coil or ignitor all together. My car had a very similar incident just a couple of weeks ago. Each time it would die was after sitting at a stop light and had taken off and was shifting from first to second and nothing.... Very quickly went to refusing to start at all.... Luckly stranded me only a 65.00 tow from home. Replaced the coil and ignitor, THANK YOU SHAWN PEASE, and off I went.

I'm not saying it can't be the fuel filter but don't rule out the ignitor and coil and they are easy to test.

Leslie

 

[trdmkii]

i would definitly test igniter and coil first but also don't rule out the fuel pump, if its going out you could be getting weak fuel pressure......but test everything before you replace, if you throw parts at it youll end up spending too much money.

 

[SupraFiend]

yep definatly could be fuel pump. This is the 323 right? Definatly sounds like fuel. If it is the pump, do the filter as well. Most fuel pump failures are caused by clogged filters. Often you have to do both at once.

 

[Dave A.]

Does your car run okay while under load, say like in 2nd or 3rd gear with WOT? If so, then you're fuel system is probably okay. Is your check engine light coming On?

 

[Deanfun]

this is in the supra... the mazda is off the road temporarily.

coil and igniter eh...

 

[Glaucus]

Hmmm.... Could be the battery. Similar thing happened to me in my '86 last summer. I started it up, took it down the street (major street), got it up to 100km, then as I approached a turn I put the car into neutral, at which point the engine died on me. The only difference here was that I could never restart my car again and had it toed to a shop. I never thought it was the battery as I could still operate my lights and the engine cranked, but would never start. Anyway, the mechanic changed the battery and the car ran good as new.

I'm guessing that when you're driving the alternator is providing enough juice to your system, which keeps everything going, including your fuel pump and ignition. Once you idle you rely more on the battery (especially if you have your headlights on and stereo blaring like I was), which could be on it's last leg and just can't provide the current needed for ignition and/or fuel pump.

I'd also check to make sure the battery terminals are clean.

- Mike

 

[Glaucus]

i figure the reason it died int he middle of shifting is becuase when i let off the gas, not enough pressure, or shear volume, of fuel was gfetting through at the idle setting becuase the fuel filter is toast, so it died.

I'm no mechanic, but to me that doesn't add up. At idle you use less fuel, so a fuel pump/filter problem shouldn't cause what you're describing. If it were a problem with the fuel pump or filter I would expect to see problems when your engine requires more fuel, ie high RPMs, yet you said there were no problems while driving, just when it was at idle. Of course I say this with the assumption that the fuel pump is constantly pumping away to maintain fuel line pressure regardless of engine RPMs. Like I said, I'm no mechanic, but that's my reasoning here - correct me if I'm wrong.

- Mike

 

[SupraFiend]

not really, an engine requires a minimal amount of gas to maintain the oem 600 rpm idle. If the fuel pressure in the system isn't up to spec due to a bad pump or filter, the injectors will always be squirting less fuel then their supposed to. Since its such a delicate balance at idle, this would cause a stall, while you could probably keep the engine running at higher rpms where things run a little richer and the o2 sensor has a chance to see the lean condition and do something about it.

Yeah, corroded posts or a bad connection at a battery post caneasily prevent a car from starting but still have the power to light the interior lights and such.

Any updates Dean?

 

[Deanfun]

i replaced the filter, and the pump works.

so the car is getting fuel.

i pulled a plug today, and lo and behold, no spark. wtf. i'm betting the rain screwed something up now...


i pulled the wire directly off teh coil and it didn't have spark either, so i'm going to bring my multimeter and a coi/ignitor and replace those.

gotta look up in the online TSRM about where the relays and fuses related to the ignition system are. damnit... i HATE wiring.

any suggestions or thoughts?

 

[SupraFiend]

probably the ignitor then. could be as simple as a loose distibuter wire though, I had that happen once.

 

[Glaucus]

Any updates?